Building Archers (my players stay out)

[drdevoid]

L4 goblin fighters get 5 feats.

I believe Drawmack was also going with Improved Initiative. Otherwise those goblins could have almost every basic archery feat.

 

[Balgus]

tack on that a couple MW bows and arrows, and you get some more bonuses to hit.

I prefer the ftr 4 to get the weapon spec- bows.

so you have +9 to hit(BAB4+2dex+1MWbow+1MWarrow+weapon focus:bow)
with damage at 1d6+2

That is a pretty hefty to hit at lvl 4. and the 5 feats can be
impr ini, weapon focus, weapon spec, point blank, rapid shot.

Precise shot does not really matter cause you only take the penalty if you are tryting to avoid hitting the person who is engaged with the PC. If you can care less- fire away and you have no penalties. If you send a couple Goblins in melee as canon fodder and have the specialized ones fire from range- you can basically kill them all.

 

[MavrickWeirdo]

Goblins are not known for caring about their allies

 

[Wicht]

I can understand wanting to use fighters, though I personally think the rogues sneak attack at 3rd level is better then the +2 from weapon specialization and that rogues fit the goblin type better then straight fighters.

But why keep insisting on using the short bows instead of the light crossbows?

 

[Bagpuss]

Don't forget they are Small size so the Str 8, -1 to hit will be off-set by the +1 to hit due to their size.

I prefer the ftr 4 to get the weapon spec- bows.

so you have +9 to hit(BAB4+2dex+1MWbow+1MWarrow+weapon focus:bow)
with damage at 1d6+2

which you appear to have forgot to add here.

4 BAB +2 dex + 1 MW bow, +1 MW arrow + 1 Weapon focus +1 size

+10 with their short bows, or +8/+8 when doing Rapid Shot.

With a possible +1 to hit and damage from Point Blank Shot.

Don't forget the size modifier for AC as well.

 

[drdevoid]

But why keep insisting on using the short bows instead of the light crossbows?

Good Point. The only reason that comes to mind is whether or not rapid shot is in use and/or the goblins are engaged in melee while still shooting. The bow gets 1 AoO where the crossbow gets 2 AoOs (one for use in melee and one for reloading). Otherwise it's a simple 1d6 vs. 1d8 scenario.

I agree that the rogue is a better fit for the Goblins, but in playing the numbers game getting a ranged sneak attack can be tricky. The skill points are also wasted since the archers just need to hide (maybe climb) and are already small with a dex bonus and possible circumstantial or cover bonuses. Evasion may come into play if we go a-fireballin', but Uncanny Dodge 1 is unimportant since they will be ambushing the PCs. I'd give up those SAs for the HD if these archers are meant to last for any amount of time, especially with crappy Con.

These boys need studded leather or chain shirts and potions of Cat's Grace! If one is really playing up the ambush effect they may have already drank the potions increasing their AC (probably up to 16 or 17) and Init ahead of time- that's kind of sick, though.

The potions are cheaper than MW bow/crossbows would be which, if I'm the head villan, is nice. Low overhead means we can pass the evil savings straight to you. [edit] Didn't want to mispeak egregiously, the potions are only marginally cheaper (the MW bonus costs the same as the potion itself so the MW ammo is what is more expensive) unless the wizard is the creator of said potions, but I do think one gets more bang for the buck. [/edit]

-Joe Sullivan
"The Future's bright,
The Future is Dr. Devoid"

 

[Baron Von StarBlade]

Also remember you can't use Rapid Shot with a Crossbow since it takes a MEA to load it.

 

[Broken Fang]

I like Wicht's versions. Think about it...if they get the jump on the party, whick looks likely the following would occur:

1. 6 shots at +7 to hit (hits AC 17-18 on average)
2. the party is flat-footed (who knows what this does to their Dex, but it will probably hurt)
3. Each shot that hits (assuming within 30') averages 11-12 points of damge
4. Some type of poison that could be havested by the goblins would require a save to be made
- Giant Wasp poision is DC 18. d6 Dex, d6 Dex
- Large Scorpion is DC 18, d6 Str, d6 Str
- Carrion Crawler DC 13, paralysis, -

Tactic - place them in either two groups of three or three groups of two, each group targeting a different PC. This could potentially ruin 1-3 PC's day if hit and a failed save or two is made.

If getting within 30' is not possible I would go with straight 4th level Fighters with bows and go for Rapid Shot at long ranges. You still need to be within 30' for Weapon Specialization to work so why bother if your outside that range anyway.

I'd definetaly add poison to the list of things they would do though!

 

[DM with a vengence]

I would just like to note that you can give these guys exceptional stats. Just giving them the standard array will increase their combat power significantly. I always use better stats for anything over 1st level, or not a mook monster.

 

[Ereanor]

ranged threat feat

The quintessential elf book has ranged threat feat(it's a general feat) which you can threaten an area 20 feet away as if you had a reach. You would be able to flank, sneak attack and deal attacks of opportunity with a ranged weapon within 20 feet.