Calibans, Mongrelfolk and diability awareness

Yes, they were first introduced in AD&D (1e) in the Greyhawk adventure “Dwellers of the Forbidden City” and added to the rulebooks in Monster Manual 2 as Mongrelmen. By 3e, the name was Mongrelfolk.

I don’t recall them being “disabled”. Perhaps that’s lore added along the way that I missed?
I don't think they've specifically been called out as disabled, but are usually so randomly put together that they walk with a limp (uneven legs) and may be effectively be missing limbs because one hand is actually a hoof or something else useless for gripping or fine motor skills.
 

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Well, all that arsenic that was added to copper to make bronze would have definitely had a negative effect even in the safest smiths.

Sure.
But look at those mythic smiths: Volund/Wayland is hamstrung. Hephaestus/Vulcan is club-footed.

These are not symptoms of poisoning or long-term chemical exposure. They are injuries or malformities to the legs that allow them to remain clever and keep working.
 

Sure.
But look at those mythic smiths: Volund/Wayland is hamstrung. Hephaestus/Vulcan is club-footed.

These are not symptoms of poisoning or long-term chemical exposure. They are injuries or malformities to the legs that allow them to remain clever and keep working.
According to Wikipedia:

Hephaestus's appearance and physical disability are taken by some to represent peripheral neuropathy and skin cancer resulting from arsenicosis caused by arsenic exposure from metalworking.[87] Bronze Age smiths added arsenic to copper to produce harder arsenical bronze, especially during periods of tin scarcity. Many Bronze Age smiths would have suffered from chronic arsenic poisoning as a result of their livelihood. Consequently, the mythic image of the disabled smith is widespread. As Hephaestus was an iron-age smith, not a bronze-age smith, the connection is one from ancient folk memory.[88]

While sure, persistent injuries are undoubtedly part of the myth's cause, it's not like the Bronze Age people who came up with the original myths would care about the difference between an injury caused by a physical object and an injury caused by nerve damage or tumor. They just knew that blacksmith = difficulty walking and brought it into their stories, and it continued there into the Iron Age myths.
 

According to Wikipedia:

With all respect, wikipedia saying his disability is "taken by some" is not authoritative.

Especially when the same wikipedia article notes that the source of Hephaestus' disability is explicitly given in the myths - he is either born that way, or Zeus injures him for trying to protect Hera from his advances. Similarly with Vulcan - he's an ugly baby, so Juno pitches him off Olympus, and he breaks his leg in the fall.



While sure, persistent injuries are undoubtedly part of the myth's cause, it's not like the Bronze Age people who came up with the original myths would care about the difference

With respect, this assertion that the Bronze Age people "wouldn't care" is pure supposition on your part, with no supporting evidence.

The people of the Bronze Age were not stupid. They could tell the difference between an injury, and a disability that develops over time. If they could tell the difference why would they not care about that difference? Why wouldn't that difference be in the myths that explain their world?
 

I don't think they've specifically been called out as disabled, but are usually so randomly put together that they walk with a limp (uneven legs) and may be effectively be missing limbs because one hand is actually a hoof or something else useless for gripping or fine motor skills.
While disability isnt explicitly used some products use the terms 'deformed humanoids' and 'deformities' (I know Pathfinder does and a quick google of the Forgotten Realm wiki:)) and yeah its suggested that some defomrities are debilitating.
 

I was working on a setting that had a similar type of folk and I called them "evri" because they had "a little bit of everything in them." They were generally held in high regard in the setting.
A few years ago I ran a Ravenloft campaign, in which the equivalent were "Stitched", because they were literally stitched together. And like the Phage from ST:Voyager, some of their number harvested body parts to replace failing ones, in a bid to approximate immortality.
 

This sounds unnecessarily nit-picky, especially when "they dropped a red-hot sword on themselves" is both "not authoritative" and it's kind of ridiculous to expect that this would happen so often that myths would be built around it--and that only the resultant limp would be build around it and not the clumsiness.

With all respect, wikipedia saying his disability is "taken by some" is not authoritative.

Especially when the same wikipedia article notes that the source of Hephaestus' disability is explicitly given in the myths - he is either born that way, or Zeus injures him for trying to protect Hera from his advances. Similarly with Vulcan - he's an ugly baby, so Juno pitches him off Olympus, and he breaks his leg in the fall.
OK, you do know that these origin stories are made up by human storytellers, right? There wasn't some documentary crew up on Mount Olympus actually recording everything. The stories are supposed to be fantastical and contain larger-than-life individuals and events.

Bronzesmiths had injuries and malformations often enough that this became memetic, in the original meaning of the word meme: information that is passed on from person to person.

The early storytellers knew the meme. They may or may not have known its origins. Maybe they knew enough about smithing to know that something about it injured smiths and/or smiths were extraordinarily clumsy. Maybe, being storytellers or priests, they didn't have much to do with the people who did physical labor and therefore had no idea why.

So here comes a story about Hephaestus, and he clearly has to be disabled. How? Well, they could use something boring and human like weird chronic diseases or accidental injuries, or they could use the idea that had thrown from the heavens or injured by a god.

With respect, this assertion that the Bronze Age people "wouldn't care" is pure supposition on your part, with no supporting evidence.

The people of the Bronze Age were not stupid. They could tell the difference between an injury, and a disability that develops over time. If they could tell the difference why would they not care about that difference? Why wouldn't that difference be in the myths that explain their world?
I didn't say they were stupid. I said they wouldn't care because that bit of knowledge isn't needed when it comes to telling a story. It's not like these myths were written with scientific or medical realism in mind.

(Although they did use arsenic in their bronzemaking--admittedly, this was a millennia or so before it was commonly known to be poisoning--so yes, I think that maybe no, they didn't know that some of the materials they used had toxic effects. Especially since it can cause neuropathies which can make other injuries easier to obtain and therefore the exact cause of those injuries would be harder to pinpoint--if someone broke a leg, how exactly would they know if it was because they fell or because they were suffering from bone degradation that caused the bone to be weak enough to break.)

One would think that if they knew the difference enough to put it in their myths, the stories wouldn't have to say "Hephaestus got thrown from Mount Olympus" and instead would say "Hephaestus dropped a red-hot robot on his foot and it burned clean off."
 

Bronzesmiths had injuries and malformations often enough that this became memetic, in the original meaning of the word meme: information that is passed on from person to person.

The early storytellers knew the meme. They may or may not have known its origins. Maybe they knew enough about smithing to know that something about it injured smiths and/or smiths were extraordinarily clumsy. Maybe, being storytellers or priests, they didn't have much to do with the people who did physical labor and therefore had no idea why.
This seems highly speculative. As far as I’m aware, only Hephaestus is a lame smith: Vulcan is a syncretized form with an earlier Etruscan deity, Velchans, about whom little is known. And Volund isn’t attested until the 6th century (and that’s dubious), and may himself be a syncretic deity, incorporating Vulcan.

Which is to say, lameness/deformity is a function of the character of Hephaestus, not of gods of the forge in general. But there might be something I’m missing.
 
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This seems highly speculative. As far as I’m aware, only Hephaestus is a lame smith: Vulcan is a syncretized form with an earlier Etruscan deity, Velchans, about whom little is known. And Volund isn’t attested until the 6th century (and that’s dubious), and may himself be a syncretic deity, incorporating Vulcan.

Which is to say, lameness/deformity is a function of the character of Hephaestus, not of gods of the forge in general. But there might be something I’m missing.

I have no idea how the topic veered into this territory lol ! But it reminds me that one of my favorite characters, Claudius, as presented in I, Claudius is disabled and for a period during Caligula's reign, is mistaken by Caligula for Vulcan because he is lame (or he at least begins referring to him as Vulcan)
 

Which is to say, lameness/deformity is a function of the character of Hephaestus, not of gods of the forge in general. But there might be something I’m missing.
That is true. I did a couple of minutes of admittedly not-very deep research and only found one other smith god that had any sort of disability, and that was Amaterasu, who had one eye, which has several possibilities behind it, only one of which is due to forge accidents.

Although it should be noted that the toxic arsenic thing is specifically bronze age. By the time the iron age rolled around, the legends may have evolved away from that.
 

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