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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Asisreo" data-source="post: 9590329" data-attributes="member: 7019027">The reason I can't seem to believe that martials are so far behind casters in terms of anything is because I've really yet to hear anything concrete in favor of that argument. Its all mostly vague assertions based on several implicit assumptions which I'm supposed to hold true, despite my experience. I mean, if you say that "martials run out of resources during a dungeon just as fast or faster than a caster", then it should be logical to ask how you'd be so sure. I mean, you can reference their healing spell slots and defensive spells, but that's really not concrete. If I spend a spell slot healing, I can't use that spell slot for other things. Likewise, if I spent that spell slot on other things, I can't use that slot for healing. If a group of martials end up dying before a group of spellcasters, or vice versa, how do we know that the unsuccessful group didn't play suboptimally, rather than the class themselves carrying the entire dungeon. Playing a martial might seem like its simple, but there are still things that a martial has to consider that maybe a caster doesn't. Obviously the reverse of that is true too. Its very possible to just make a bad decision and lose everything even if you felt like it wasn't a bad decision.</blockquote>