Can a town exist in a dungeon(my players, stay out)?

[blackshirt5]

OK, I'm designing one of the main dungeons of my world:
The Castle Ruins of Leeds the Many-Colored

It's similar to Gygax's Castle Greyhawk(which was one of my inspirations) in that it's a dungeon that extends many levels down into the deep underground(how many levels, even I'm not sure yet), that is rumored to contain such lovely things as imprisoned demon lords, trapped gods, and magical artifacts.

The question I had was this: Do you think it'd be feasible for adventurers to be able to clear a level of the dungeon out and build up a town/waystation for other adventurers? It's gonna be built on the fourth level down, so that the anybody who wants to get in has to pass through both the castle(which is deserted, except for Leeds' old servitor Vode, and a multitude of traps), the Catacombs, a level called The Armory, and what has been dubbed The Dark Labyrinth.

The point behind building the town(dubbed Fortresstown by it's founders) on the fourth sub-level is to:
A) Keep Vode out. Vode is insane and undead(a death knight), he would conduct a one-man siege of any town built on or around his old master's grounds.
B) Keep out the newbies. The adventurers(or former adventurers) who run Fortresstown don't want to have to deal with anyone who can't make it past the dangers of the castle proper, the catacombs, the armory, and the dark labyrinth.
C) Ease their own forays. With an underground town past the Dark Labyrinth, they don't have to travel through the labyrinth each time they want to explore below.
D) Making a killing on the money. When you've got two choices, pay to sleep here in the inn, or travel back up through the dungeon to the surface, you can make a decent buck. Balanced of course by the fact that you're dealing with fellow adventurers.

So, does anybody else like this idea?

Another point that came to mind as I was designing this last night is that this could act as a safe haven for the party(who are basically in a world gone mad, evil forces have placed themselves in power all over the world) as well as other heroes. The Demon Elves can't really get into the ruins except for the old-fashioned, human way(coming in from the top), and the power of all the magic that radiates from within the dungeon helps block out scrying attempts.

 

[Piratecat]

Umm - how busy are these ruins, anyways? It doesn't sound viable to me, not without dozens of people trooping through there on a regular basis. It wouldn't work out in my world - but I don't have super-dungeons like that.

Hey, if it would make the game more fun, go with it!

 

[herald]

I had thought about doing something simular. Please post your results.

 

[Umbran]

If Vode has a problem with people coming and going, then settlement is not really viable. That "town" isn't going to have any source of supplies - food being the biggie, but it won't be producing anything else for itself, either. So, stuff will have to be brought in. That's gonna get expensive. And you'll pobably have to pay people exhorbitant fees to "live" in the town, so separated from the rest of the world, so hazardous.

Oh, and is there anything in particular keeping that death knight from coming down and laying seige to the town? Is he glued to the floor, or something? 'Cause otherwise I think he's gonna notice the shenanigans and do something about them.

Never, ever, leave intelligent undead alive behind you.

 

[blackshirt5]

Fortresstown is pretty well-inhabited, and after you get to a certain rank within the Adventurer's Guild, you end up being told about it(one of the players was offered membership in the Adventurer's Guild, but he turned it down, so they're flying blind, they've got no clue the town is there).

There are probably a few hundred inhabitants of Fortresstown, almost all adventurers or ex-adventurers who have taken up permanent residency in this place(it really is quite cozy, especially for a dwarf). While not everybody gets along(come on, diverse groups of adventurers coming together from around the world, getting along perfectly? not likely), they all understand the need to maintain security and keep the town safe. Duels of honor have been broken off in the middle and forgotten due to sudden attacks by cthonians, ghouls, or other nasties.

The Dark Labyrinth, once you get past it into Fortresstown, is not something you really need to worry about, since its most dangerous inhabitants(the infamous Labyrinth Tanks, created long ago by Leeds the Many-Colored with a mixture of sorcery and steam) cannot get out of the Dark Labyrinth(they're too big). The inhabitants that can get out(minor undead such as wights, ghouls and ghasts, and wraiths) can be dealt with.

The level below, dubbed The Great Vault by Reona, one of the founders of Fortresstown, is not a problem, as long as you heed Reona's advice and STAY ON THE STAIRS!, as straying from the staircase that leads down to the next level will allow the inhabitants of that level to attack you(they cannot set foot upon the staircase however).

Level B6, known as the Complex, has been causing some problems, mostly because of the alien mindset of the inhabitants(it's a clockwork colony), and their hatred of magic items. Additionally, rumors of great treasure hidden within the protected Vaults of the 6th level have brought more adventurers(especially thieves and other roguish characters, who speak of something or someone on the level "calling" to them) onto the 6th level.

The 7th level is the lair of the dragon Naris. Not much is known about Naris, except that he'll allow safe passage by paying him tribute(namely, paying out a good portion of your treasure). He especially likes waiting for return trips to Fortresstown.

The 8th level is called Eron's City. It's another city under the dungeon, similar to Fortresstown, except that it's inhabitants are all undead. Though most hate the living with a burning passion, the ruler of the city, the vampire lord Eron the Relentless, is cordial enough to visitors who obey his rules(namely, drinking of his blood, and trading some of their own blood for safe passage).

Beyond Eron's City lays the Warrens of the Demons, and beyond those lay levels even further down. A few rumors speak of a god fallen to earth who lays below the castle, still worshipped by mad cultists, a great vertical hallway that was transported from another plane into the dungeon by one of Leeds' magical experiments, and another dragon, far older and more terrible than Naris, laying atop a mountain of treasure.

But yes, to answer your question, the town is defended zealously by all of it's residents.

 

[blackshirt5]

The fact that Vode has to pass through the Catacombs, the Armory, and the Dark Labyrinth, after having lost his ring that allowed him to bypass all the dangers of those levels(he can't simply command the inhabitants to stand down anymore) is impairing him from simply coming down and laying waste to Fortresstown.

Good point about the import of food however, Umbran. Methinks that maybe the elves aren't as happy down there, but Dwarves could grow fungus foods and such, and raise their underground livestock. Fortresstown is huge, it took a group of about 20 highly trained adventurers 25 years to fully clear out the level that became Fortresstown, and even now there are a few areas that simply aren't touched out of tradition and fear.

Also, Leeds, in life, was a madman who set himself up as a king in the middle of what have come to be called The Leeds Plains. He was called the Many-Colored because he wore a runecloak that shimmered in every possible color, signifying his mastery over all manner of magic(the party wizard, Tak, actually admires his diversity, although not his instability).

 

[Hand of Evil]

I think it is possible but as a small trading post, groups from the underdark and from the surface would meet and trade. It would be a halfway place. Groups would travel a well defined path but would not travel from from it.

Now, you would have to think fringe dwellers. These would be the monsters/creatures/bad guys that would prey on the travellers. Why are they there? Why do they stay? Why do they keep coming back? Where do they keep coming from?

You have to place the ruins in a hard-to-get-to-place, so that the number of travellers would be limited. And you have to make the trade worth it! Why would anyone risk life and limb to come to the town and trade items. This could be key!

 

[blackshirt5]

It's not only a matter of coming to Fortresstown to trade items(although considering the caliber of adventurers that hang out there, it's a distinct possibility that some people come there just to do that). Fortresstown is there to have a safe haven, a well-fortified basecamp, for explorations and forays further underground into the ruins. One of the things that impeded the original groups of adventurers who created Fortresstown was that they'd have to break off exploration early to get back to the surface, or else risk death venturing back through the Dark Labyrinth. So they chose to clear the level below the Dark Labyrinth and turn it into a basecamp, and they used their connections to the Adventurer's Guild in Freeport to bring in other adventurers(to help in the security and diversify the availability of resources in the town).

After 25 years, the town has drawn some highly skilled adventurers from all over the world(samurai, Nyambean warriors, Khemites, dwarven craftsmen, and many more), so the variety of services you can purchase is disproportionate to the town's relatively small size, and you can hire a wide selection of skilled mercenaries(the first trip through the Dark Labyrinth is always the hardest, because on return trips you can hire a minotaur to guide you through, for example). There's a thieves guild(all of the thieves seem a bit distracted in their day to day lives, however, since they all feel the urgent call of Drendari, the demigoddess of shadow, who is imprisoned two levels below, in the level called The Complex. And yes, I am borrowing Drendari from the Scarred Lands.), armorers, weaponsmiths, magic users. A good number of adventurers choose to stay here if they retire(especially dwarves), continuing to make money selling their wares(be those wares training, swords, healing, divination, or whatever).

Basically, the idea is to have a frontier town with a major twist. You're cut off from civilization more than with most frontier towns in this world, because you'd have a hard time teleporting from this one(thanks to the high levels of magic all throughout the dungeon; Reona will recount the story of a hard-arse dwarven mage that is now eulogized as McSplat, who didn't heed the warnings from others about the dangers of teleporting within the dungeon). Dunno, I'll see how my players like it. But with the variety of player options that they can bring into the game in this town(as I said, adventurers come from all over the world. Leeds Castle is famous the world over[and it's gonna be a big world when it's done] as a place of great wealth and as a proving grounds[which is why such a high number of samurai make the long journey from the East to come here to prove their honor] for young heroes[and villains].)

 

[Murrdox]

Did you ever play Ultima: Underworld?

In that game you were stuck underground in the Abyss (Not the D&D Abyss, we're talking the Ultima world here) which was basically a 9 level dungeon.

There were fairly large settlements on some of the upper levels. I think the size was only maybe a few hundred inhabitants though.

If this dungeon is THAT huge then go for it! How big the dungeon is and how self-sufficient it can be (food, water, supplies) will determine how large it gets.

Perhaps adventurers are co-operating with species who are accustomed to living underground?

I mean, you're basically just re-inventing something like the Underdark in Forgotten Realms. You sound like you've got a really interesting idea going on this one.

 

[Datt]

Ah the fond memories of Ultima. I remember my first time through the Abyss in Ultima 4. Man how I hated that dungeon. Almost as much as I hated the dungeon at the end of Utlima 5. Anyway.

I really like what you have planned blackshirt. It sounds like you have done quite a bit of planning on this one. I really like the idea that nobody really knows exactly how deep the dungeon goes. A mystery that might never be solved! I say just figure out a way to have some running water in the town, a old well Leeds used to fuel some of his experiments or something. But I definetly think it is workable!