-
NOW LIVE! Into the Woods--new character species, eerie monsters, and haunting villains to populate the woodlands of your D&D games.
Can sieges withstand magical assault?
- Thread starter azmodean
- Start date
Sir ThornCrest
First Post
potent magical capability vs warmachines vs uncovered attackers 5-1 odds
If both sides had equal forces lets say 500 1st level fighters and 2 5th level Wizards the attacking force would be severly handicapped-no walls no roofs they would be a 5 too 1 under dog. Now if they would stay back and somehow draw the opposing force out this would quickly even up the odds.,
Sit Thorn Crest
If both sides had equal forces lets say 500 1st level fighters and 2 5th level Wizards the attacking force would be severly handicapped-no walls no roofs they would be a 5 too 1 under dog. Now if they would stay back and somehow draw the opposing force out this would quickly even up the odds.,
Sit Thorn Crest
Narfellus
First Post
Well, lets look at this in terms of what is available magic-wise to default DnD characters, as useful in attacking a castle during a siege:
Darkness, Protection from Arrows, Endure/Resist Energy and Elements (from burning oil), Hold Portal (might have a use), Grease, Obscuring Mist...
Wait a minute. Pretty much every spell is useful. I'll eventually get to Disinegrate and then Game's Over. So, in answer to your post, YES, given balanced magic, and one side anticipated the attack from the other, then appropriate counter measures could be taken. A mix of clerics and wizards on both sides could raze and defend a castle with equality. It would be much a like a regular DnD skirmish on a huge scale.
Interesting enough, i was just reading Clash of Kings yesterday during a certain siege. On the dawn of the first day, before the battle is even joined, the leading commander is killed by (in DnD terms) a relatively low level spell. As magic is virtually unknown in the Seven Kingdoms, no one had any defense or idea of what or how it happened.
In a low magic campaign, magic used wisely (and viciously) can turn even enormous odds to your advantage.
Darkness, Protection from Arrows, Endure/Resist Energy and Elements (from burning oil), Hold Portal (might have a use), Grease, Obscuring Mist...
Wait a minute. Pretty much every spell is useful. I'll eventually get to Disinegrate and then Game's Over. So, in answer to your post, YES, given balanced magic, and one side anticipated the attack from the other, then appropriate counter measures could be taken. A mix of clerics and wizards on both sides could raze and defend a castle with equality. It would be much a like a regular DnD skirmish on a huge scale.
Interesting enough, i was just reading Clash of Kings yesterday during a certain siege. On the dawn of the first day, before the battle is even joined, the leading commander is killed by (in DnD terms) a relatively low level spell. As magic is virtually unknown in the Seven Kingdoms, no one had any defense or idea of what or how it happened.
In a low magic campaign, magic used wisely (and viciously) can turn even enormous odds to your advantage.
My vote: No.
If both sides have remotely equal resources the people in the castle are doomed; the costs for wonderous architecture and/or significant warding magic for the castle & it's inhabitants is simply too high.
One 6th level sorcerer lobbing acid-substituted fireballs will take down walls (and defenders) pretty darn quick.
Not to mention the absolute destruction a mid-to-high level Druid can rain down upon the (relatively) stationary defenders *shudder*.
If both sides have remotely equal resources the people in the castle are doomed; the costs for wonderous architecture and/or significant warding magic for the castle & it's inhabitants is simply too high.
One 6th level sorcerer lobbing acid-substituted fireballs will take down walls (and defenders) pretty darn quick.
Not to mention the absolute destruction a mid-to-high level Druid can rain down upon the (relatively) stationary defenders *shudder*.
jerichothebard
First Post
If we are making the assumption that the fortress and defensive strategies are designed with magical assault in mind, then yes, I think it could hold - at least as well as a mundane siege can be resisted. So long as your spellcasters live, magic is, in essence, an endless resource... it renews every day, remember!
Plus, access to spells allowing for the creation of food and water, curing of disease, and disposal of waste would in fact make resisting a siege easier. Those factors often ended sieges, well before military might could hope to make a dent in the castle.
Plus, access to spells allowing for the creation of food and water, curing of disease, and disposal of waste would in fact make resisting a siege easier. Those factors often ended sieges, well before military might could hope to make a dent in the castle.
Narfellus
First Post
Pyrex said:
I think that spellcasters in such a situation would be the PRIME TARGET for anyone inside the walls. Arrows, catapults, trebuchets, scorpions, etc. would be trained on any spellcasting unit. Of course, the defensive tactics are endless. Invisible casters, illusory doubles, flying spellcasters, etc. You up the ante on one side (in a magically balanced assault) and the other side will have the solution (dispel magic, see invisible, etc..) I don't know if there's enough damage you could do that couldn't be repaired/countered somehow by the other side.
In my opinion, the deciding factor would simply be magic that one side of the other doesn't have access to, does not expect, or cannot defend against. No defense against a few Cloudkills could wipe out an army, no matter which side of the wall they're on.
arscott
First Post
I don't think that's necessarily the case. A castle can stand up to a lot of damage. Your acid subbed fireballs are only going to do so much damage over a relatively small area. Whereas the attackers are supposed. And the defending wizards don't have to spend levels for metamagic just to make the building take normal damage..
painandgreed
First Post
If you have equal forces but one has a defensive foritfication, then of course the side with the advantage of defensive foritifucations has the edge. What magic means is that attacking defensive foritifications with an equal forces might actually have a chance since magic can remove some serious blocks on the defences. Disintigrate or lightneing bolt the friont gate while fireballing or holding the gates defenders to allow forces to rush in has a chance where in history without magic, attacking a defensive foritificatoin with an equal force was suicide.
When we've played this sort of battle, both as defenders and attackers, magic comes in quick and furious and the battle is decided in the next few minutes. The attackers cast their spells and get a chance to attack. Once the defenders get off their spells things equal out again, so it's all about how much of an advantage the attackers can get between begining the attack and the defenders responding. Once things equal out it becomes a slugfest and as various spell durations for things like hold, web, and sleep wear out, the advantage goes back to the defenders. This is especially true if the defenders are held at a small breech in the wall they've opened. Then they're all in one spot and can be hit by area effect spells and missle weapons much easier than the defenders who are spread out more. in a large seige, there will be a large push and if the attackers don't manage to break through the defences and keep pouring troops in, they'll be forced to pull back and wait till the next day when their magic users have their spells again for another try.
When we've played this sort of battle, both as defenders and attackers, magic comes in quick and furious and the battle is decided in the next few minutes. The attackers cast their spells and get a chance to attack. Once the defenders get off their spells things equal out again, so it's all about how much of an advantage the attackers can get between begining the attack and the defenders responding. Once things equal out it becomes a slugfest and as various spell durations for things like hold, web, and sleep wear out, the advantage goes back to the defenders. This is especially true if the defenders are held at a small breech in the wall they've opened. Then they're all in one spot and can be hit by area effect spells and missle weapons much easier than the defenders who are spread out more. in a large seige, there will be a large push and if the attackers don't manage to break through the defences and keep pouring troops in, they'll be forced to pull back and wait till the next day when their magic users have their spells again for another try.
Similar Threads
