Can someone explain what "1st ed feel" is?

[Son_of_Thunder]

Almost forgot!

Oh ya,

And 1st edition feel was simple classes uncomplicated by unnecessary rules.

Cheers,

Son_of_Thunder

 

[Voneth]

1st ed feel.

Pick up Diablo or play Everquest and you have 1st Ed feel. Which may explain why some what that feeling. Every read articles from the Diablo designers.

"We had a simple plan, Let the player kill something and then reward him, it's almost Pavlovian."

 

[Pielorinho]

No, I get what you're saying. The thing is, plausibility was another element the DM provided. 1e modules were so underwritten that a DM had to individualize them.

I guess we agree, then, on what they were like; we just disagree on whether that's a good thing.

Daniel

 

[Squire James]

They do, but not generally under moathouses.

Daniel

In that particular case, they didn't. The stuff under the moathouse was all dug by crazy evil people. I suppose that explanation could be used for just about anything, though!

 

[Numion]

Y'know, for those who keep complaining about how 1e had so little plot or story - you're missing an important point. Plot and story was provided by the DM then, and so could be dispensed with in the modules.

Or alternative B: There was no plot, at all.

Just call 'em like you see 'em.

 

[beta-ray]

The irony of what you said Daniel is that you explain away so easily that the tunnels can be molded by MAGIC, but you find little else PLAUSIBLE (wind in tunnels)...

Actually almost ANYTHING taken to their logical conclusion is rather alien. Even in the real world there is a lot that is not logical, because we are not purely calculating engines...

*shrug* my opinion of course

 

[MythandLore]

In that particular case, they didn't. The stuff under the moathouse was all dug by crazy evil people. I suppose that explanation could be used for just about anything, though!

It's like a wacky madlibs.

The X under the X was dug by crazy evil people.

The basement under the Taco Stand was dug by crazy evil people.

The Taco Stand under the Castle was dug by crazy evil people.

The Castle under the basement was dug by crazy evil people.

The X X the X was X by crazy evil people. -is even better-

 

[Melan]

1st ed feel.

Pick up Diablo or play Everquest and you have 1st Ed feel. Which may explain why some what that feeling. Every read articles from the Diablo designers.

"We had a simple plan, Let the player kill something and then reward him, it's almost Pavlovian."

Uh-oh. I have played Diablo I, but it isn't anything like 1st edition. If anything, it is a dumbed down Nethack (which, in turn, is based on OD&D).

1e feel is also the example of play from the 1e DMG. Compare it to the one in the 3e one: the latter is just four "iconic characters" underground - the former is a grand and wondrous adventure, with promises of further strangeness. Why? After all, they are almost the same, no?
IMO, no. Somehow, the mystwery isn't quite there, with you knowing that Lidda & Co will get away with it - but the other has this unease - will they be killed by the ghouls? Will their guide betray them to the bandits for some easy coins? Or swindle them out of their hard gotten riches? It is a dungeon, yes, but so much more - you almost feel there is a living world beyond it, and you can catch a glimpse from the corner of your eye... Weird.
I can't really define it, but it is different .

 

[Eternalknight]

It's hard to put into words what 1st edition felt like. I guess you had to be there

 

[Henry]

1st ed feel.

Pick up Diablo or play Everquest and you have 1st Ed feel. Which may explain why some what that feeling. Every read articles from the Diablo designers.

"We had a simple plan, Let the player kill something and then reward him, it's almost Pavlovian."

I also beg to differ. To make that statement is to tell me that you do not seem to have a complete understanding of what made many 1st edition modules great.

I enjoy an occasional game of Diablo, and used to play Everquest last year, but left both. Why? Because they were boring and mindless. You performed the same activities ad infinitum to get the same result. I have a friend who still plays Everquest, and he has several 30th to 50th level characters. I don't see how he does it. I have more fun with a filing cabinet.

Getting back to your statement - To coin a rather homeopathic phrase, "Less is more." One qualifier of 1st edition was a setup of fascinating situations and challenges, with a minimal amount of "Story fluff."

By story fluff, I mean the boxed text and reams of characterization notes that used to come with many 2E adventures - "For Duty and Deity" was one. You were told more about the environment of the High Cleric (of Waukeen)'s temple and offices than you were about the Abyss where Waukeen was held!!!

In many 1E adventures, there was an intriguing setup (for its day) and the how's, why's and wherefores of how the characters got into the situation were left open-ended to the DM, so that he would have an easier time to insert it into his campaign (and also because printing costs ain't cheap). There were usually enough notation of the basic character and his position to give the DM an idea of how to handle him as an NPC, and it was up to the DM to provide more flesh to his characterization.

It is true that it is part nostalgia, but there is a lesson there that many designers of 3E are returning to - even many designers at WotC (Look at Forge of Fury and Sunless Citadel for examples of this). They don't write in "complete" 1E style, but it is more writing in interesting situations and challenges such as....

SPOILER
The Kobolds and the White dragon, or the druid and his special tree...
SPOILER

...that makes it fun to run for players. Fans of 1E need new and fresh challenge ideas, not gobs and gobs of setting with little meat involved. I had more fun with Sir Bruto sans Pite and the mid-air kayaks in-stream, than I did with Volo and all his ramblings about "the multitudinous and miraculous magic of the Realms."