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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
cancelled 5e announcement at Gencon??? Anyone know anything about this?
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<blockquote data-quote="Beginning of the End" data-source="post: 5662360" data-attributes="member: 55271"><p>So the analogy is not "my grandfather smoked for 70 years, therefore smoking cigarettes isn't a problem". The analogy is "my grandfather only drove while drunk and he was always crashing the car; therefore there's something wrong with the design of the car".</p><p></p><p>The 15MAD/early-onset-LFQW is only a problem in a very specific and very narrow and very inflexible style of play. (It also, IMO, carries with it several significant problems beyond the mere mechanical exploits it allows.)</p><p></p><p>In the case of 4E, the attempt to "fix the car" so that people could drive it drunk resulted in a system which, IMO, made the car far less effective when driving it sober. Since I don't drive drunk, I don't have a problem with my existing car and "upgrading" to a car which would allow me to drive drunk while seriously debilitating the utility of the car while driving it sober just doesn't have any appeal to me.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Uh. No. Mournblade didn't say, "It's clear that Pathfinder is the greatest game ever made because they're selling really well." He said, "Clearly with Pathfinder taking off so well, the caster fighter disparity is not unplayable."</p><p></p><p>The analogy you're looking for here is, "Twilight's box office demonstrates that the movies are not literally unwatchable." Which is self-evidently true.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It is, I think, specifically the loss of utility and the significant shift in gameplay in 4E that you're overlooking. If 4E had found a way to fix the problem a limited subset of gamers were having WITHOUT throwing the baby out with the bathwater, it wouldn't have suffered the same backlash.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Beginning of the End, post: 5662360, member: 55271"] So the analogy is not "my grandfather smoked for 70 years, therefore smoking cigarettes isn't a problem". The analogy is "my grandfather only drove while drunk and he was always crashing the car; therefore there's something wrong with the design of the car". The 15MAD/early-onset-LFQW is only a problem in a very specific and very narrow and very inflexible style of play. (It also, IMO, carries with it several significant problems beyond the mere mechanical exploits it allows.) In the case of 4E, the attempt to "fix the car" so that people could drive it drunk resulted in a system which, IMO, made the car far less effective when driving it sober. Since I don't drive drunk, I don't have a problem with my existing car and "upgrading" to a car which would allow me to drive drunk while seriously debilitating the utility of the car while driving it sober just doesn't have any appeal to me. Uh. No. Mournblade didn't say, "It's clear that Pathfinder is the greatest game ever made because they're selling really well." He said, "Clearly with Pathfinder taking off so well, the caster fighter disparity is not unplayable." The analogy you're looking for here is, "Twilight's box office demonstrates that the movies are not literally unwatchable." Which is self-evidently true. It is, I think, specifically the loss of utility and the significant shift in gameplay in 4E that you're overlooking. If 4E had found a way to fix the problem a limited subset of gamers were having WITHOUT throwing the baby out with the bathwater, it wouldn't have suffered the same backlash. [/QUOTE]
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cancelled 5e announcement at Gencon??? Anyone know anything about this?
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