Cantrips

[RangerWickett]

Minor magic spells might not get much positive press, but I think they do a good job of making different spellcasters stand apart. I'm trying to come up with a nice list of variant cantrips to fit particular styles of magic.

Exact rules aren't particularly important, but what I'm going for are powers that would never be worth wasting a full utility power slot on, but which aren't covered by the existing 4e wizard cantrips - Ghost Sound, Light, Mage Hand, and Prestidigitation.

Like a more shaman-y wizard could use cantrips to speak with the spirits of nature, or possibly communicate with animals. A diabolist could call an imp to deliver a message for him, or kill small animals with a glare. A pyromancer could touch hot things without being burned. A trickster might be able to tap you on the back, and if you turn around, you're suddenly behind him, without him ever seeing you move. A hydromancer could walk slowly across water.

What are some cantrips you've used, or think would be cool?

 

[Markn]

A 3.5 wizard could make 4e disappear...Just kidding.

How about a necromancer able to manifest a ghastly visage.

By the way, I'd like to see the complete list when you get it done. This could be useful.

 

[Gort]

Just going to chip in and say that cantrips at will as a minor action are totally awesome and are almost enough reason to play a 4e wizard all on their own. I would love to see them added to some other 4e classes.

 

[Yabanjin]

The 1e cantrip Belch, which does what you expect it to do, provides hours of cheap entertainment, and should be the centerpiece of any serious undertaking involving cantrips.

 

[tuxgeo]

Just going to chip in and say that cantrips at will as a minor action are totally awesome and are almost enough reason to play a 4e wizard all on their own. I would love to see them added to some other 4e classes.

Arcane-multiclassed 4e Bards can take the "Resourceful Magician" Paragon Path [from Dragon 376], which has a Path Feature ("Greater Study") which allows Bards who are multiclassed as Wizards to gain the Cantrip class feature (and gives other benefits to Bards who are multiclassed as Sorcerers, Swordmages, or Warlocks).

(Parenthetical note: both Ghost Sound and Prestidigitation are Standard Actions.)

 

[Gort]

(Parenthetical note: both Ghost Sound and Prestidigitation are Standard Actions.)

I know, it kinda sucks. I like how you can chuck Mage Hand on at the end of your action to do all sorts of stuff, would be nice if you could do the same with the other two.

 

[Celebrim]

The 1e cantrip Belch, which does what you expect it to do, provides hours of cheap entertainment, and should be the centerpiece of any serious undertaking involving cantrips.

In 1e, I initially allowed Wizards to perform cantrips at will.

It was 'Belch' that changed my mind about this being a good idea, and forced me to limit free cantrips/day to character level.

 

[Celebrim]

What are some cantrips you've used, or think would be cool?

When you have the thing balanced as a minor action usuable at will, it severely limits your ability to be creative. I loved cantrips, but it was really the 3rd edition mechanic of making them a minor but still useful spell that made them most interesting to me.

Things you can't do with a 4e minor action cantrip:

1) Effect a skill roll. If it could, effectively the Wizard would gain ranks in all skills for free.
2) Damage a target. If it could, effectively the Wizard's damage/round would increase.
3) Apply a condition to a target. As per #2.
4) Replace a ritual. If it could, you've infringed on the ritual caster silo.
5) Gain a useful degree of immunity. It would become effectively a class feature.
6) Move the caster. If it could, effectively the Wizard would get a speed bonus.

Virtually all the 1e cantrips meet the above standard, but they also got rolled up into 'Presdigitation', which is fitting for both 3e and 4e.

Virtually all the creative and balanced 3e cantrips I encountered or thought up did one of the above 6 things.

The suggestions you make for 4e cantips seem to me to be better covered as some sort of minor low cost ritual. A possible comprimise positions is that you could come up with a feat that allowed you to select some number of minor rituals from a list to be added to your known cantrips list. Essentially thereby you'd gain a small number of at will 'utility powers' which individually would not be worth choosing as a utility power, but collectively might be worth some sacrifice to obtain. I don't know enough about 4e balance to suggest specific mechanics though.

 

[RangerWickett]

Well, some cantrips could be standard actions. Like a standard action "teleport 2 squares" cantrip, or standard action "gain resist fire 5 until the end of your next turn," or standard action "debuff an opponent's attack bonus" with a curse or something?

 

[renau1g]

Celebrim - question for you. I used mage hand to hold a torch aloft (20 lbs carrying capacity right?) above an area of the map soaked with lamp oil and when the monster walked over it, I used a minor action to drop the torch, lighting the area on fire and damaging the monster (1d4 damage from the fire). It did cause damage, but what are your thoughts on it? Would you not allow that to happen in your game? Also, the monster was mindless, hence the obliviousness to the oil.