Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 9220214" data-attributes="member: 7030563">It happens all the time, most often to it is often done to let allies get out of an AOEs, wait for an enemy to come into range (if the enemy is 50 foot from the party, moving out in front of everyone 20 feet to cast Tasha's Laughter is pretty dangerous if you are a back line caster) and finally to target invisible creatures when you expect them to become visible on their turn.Are you seriously saying this kind of thing does not happen in games you play?  I am not sure I even believe that.As a point of fact, Symbol and Magic Jar take 1 minute to cast.  I am not saying they are used for this commonly, but as a point of fact they do (or can) incapacitate a foe and do take more than an action to cast.They are if you want to understand ways to interrupt a caster.No you are "flat out wrong".  This is factually not "generally true" if you are talking about "casters".  It is very rarely true and I don't even think this is generally true if you are talking about Wizards specifically.I believe the only two 1st level spells that can cause the incapacitated condition as an action are Sleep and Tasha's Hideous Laughter.  Of full casting classes only Bards. Sorcerers and Wizards have class access to these spells and to be able to do it they would need to actually know one of those two spells or have it in their book and prepared.If you are talking about "casters" well over 90% of full casters can't cause the incapacitated condition with a 1st level spell from their class that they can cast.  I would say it is about 40% of Wizards that can do this and maybe 5% of Sorcerers and Bards and no other casters at all.If they have that spell.  Sorcerers know 2 spells at 1st level, Bards know 4.  Wizards have 6 in their book but can only prepare between 1 and 6.Charm person does not cause incapacitated.Command does not cause the incapacitated condition.  It is powerful no doubt, as are many spells and abilities that do not incapacitate, but it is not a spell that causes incapacitation.Casters only have access to THL if they know it or for Wizards and have it prepared.It depends entirely on which class and which non-caster class you are comparing it to.Monks all have the ability to incapacitate at 5th level and if we are saying this then Fighters all have the ability to incapacitate at 3rd level because they can take the Rune Knight or Eldritch Knight and Rogues because they can take Arcane Trickster.The fact that a particular Rogue or Fighter might have chosen something else instead of being able to incapacitate does not mean fighters in general do not have the ability to incapacitate.So fighters, Rogues and Monks can all incapacitate at level 3.  As far as non-casters go, we are left with Barbarians .... until level 4 when they too can get an ability to incapacitate someone.Then disarm him againI did not say they were amazing, I said they could be used to affect other martials.  Tasha's Hideous laughter is not amazing either and sleep is situational and at low level amazing in that situation.The argument was that "Martials also have access to only one method of rendering other martials unable to utilize their abilities" - that is just not factually true.</blockquote>

Verification