Changing the Self-Deleting Spell Book

[Kzach]

You get this thing called an eraser...

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

I'm confused. All classes already have the ability to retrain lower level powers. The benefit wizards possess that the other classes do not is the "double option / one per day" for their daily and utility spells.

My house rule takes away the retrain option, but lets PCs retain lower level powers and give them the potential to learn extra high level powers.

That said, I have no problem with the self editing spellbook any more than I have a problem with rogues using a sling to send a blinding barrage of bullets at half a dozen enemies. Wizards do / are / embody magic. Their books are special. Heck, my computer is self editing and I'm not even a wizard.

I've got no problem with information storage that self-edits, but I do have a problem with information storage that self-deletes. There's an important functional difference there.

TS

 

[Pielorinho]

Here's my solution:
They don't disappear from the spellbook. It's just that the wizard is out of practice with them.

When a fighter retrains Steel Serpent Strike and instead takes Spinning Sweep, it's not like the sword she used to make her Steel Serpent Strike vanishes. She's just stopped practicing that maneuver during her downtime, and so she's no longer competent at it.

Similarly, the wizard who retrains Sleep to take Acid Arrow doesn't watch as the spell vanishes from his spellbook. He just hasn't been practicing the Sleep spell lately, and so he's no longer competent at using it.

This seems to me like the simplest solution and one that maintains balance while preserving plausibility.

Daniel

 

[Nyteloki]

I honestly like Pielorinho's idea. I would go a bit further in my games as a house rule though. I would still give all players access to the abilities they retained out of, but I would use the out of practice reasoning in accessing a penalty to the attack rolls of that power. Anyone that uses an ability that they once had, but then retained out of it for another ability can use the old, out of practice power at a -4 or -5 penalty (play testing would be needed to determine the correct penalty).

I would further allow wizards one exception to the above rule. In a nod to their versatility, I would allow them to use the daily power that they did not prepare but could have prepared instead, at a negative -2 attack penalty. That way they can still use this ability if it is needed, but the penalty is not as high as normal since they have been practicing the ability but not as much as the ability they prepared.

Further, if you used the (alternate) power that you did not prepare, you could not use the power that you prepared and visa-versa. This should ensure that wizards do not get to use all their abilities in one day, just that any that they have learned and recorded are still available to them, if not at a significant cost.

In essence this means that a level one wizards could prepare sleep and have acid arrow as his back up. The place for sleep never comes us, so he would instead use acid arrow. By doing so, he makes his attack roll at a -2 penalty (he is practiced but not perfect with it as he did not spend the extra time familiarizing himself with the spell that is necessary to prepare it). When he makes use of that power, whether he hits or not, his daily power is used. He could not later on determine that sleep would be good, as he has already used his daily power on acid arrow.

When a power is replaced by another power, the wizards would take the standard -5 penalty to use the now replaced power, just like any other class.

As for books as treasures, I would be inclined to include them boss treasures.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Here's my solution:
They don't disappear from the spellbook. It's just that the wizard is out of practice with them.

When a fighter retrains Steel Serpent Strike and instead takes Spinning Sweep, it's not like the sword she used to make her Steel Serpent Strike vanishes. She's just stopped practicing that maneuver during her downtime, and so she's no longer competent at it.

Similarly, the wizard who retrains Sleep to take Acid Arrow doesn't watch as the spell vanishes from his spellbook. He just hasn't been practicing the Sleep spell lately, and so he's no longer competent at using it.

This seems to me like the simplest solution and one that maintains balance while preserving plausibility.

Daniel

This is a great solution, so long as the DM is willing to allow PCs to prep their out-of-practice powers instead of their regulars on the off chance that a PC thinks it'll come in handy. Some DMs wouldn't allow it, so this solution depends on the DM too.

TS

 

[Pielorinho]

This is a great solution, so long as the DM is willing to allow PCs to prep their out-of-practice powers instead of their regulars on the off chance that a PC thinks it'll come in handy. Some DMs wouldn't allow it, so this solution depends on the DM too.

If a player asked to do that, my first response would be a glower and saying, "Don't push it, or those are gonna start disappearing from your spellbook." My idea isn't so much to change the rules as to change the flavor-text. If necessary, I'd add a little bit of flavor text pointing out how difficult it is to get in practice for a spell, how it takes weeks to recall all the little gestures and words. Takes, in fact, about the same amount of time as it takes to gain a level. And they get back in practice with that old spell by neglecting practice with their new one.

Again, compare it to a fighter. Fighters don't even have to write their exploits down anywhere: they just practice them. If a fighter retrains an exploit, I'm not going to let them prepare their old one on any given day. They're out of practice with the old one.

Daniel