Character Choices for a Newbie

[Emperor_Ner0]

Hey guys,

I am new to pen and paper RPGs, though through video games (Neverwinter Nights Diamond Edition) I am a little familiar with how things work. I am completely new to the Pathfinder rule set though. I am starting a game with my uncle and his friends sometime this week and he is a veteran D&D and Warhammer player but is also new to Pathfinder.(One of his friends is the progeny of the ruleset change) The question is what kind of character do you recommend? The story is going to be something traditional high fantasy, male-oriented, rebel-rousing and all. I have an idea of what I want to do, but a little experience and some suggestions would be nice.

I want to play a quick-witted, smart alec, chaotic neutral, something. I want to be charismatic and be able to talk my way out of sticky situations. I am leaning more towards human, and I am wanting to go the spell casting route and I am a huge fan of necromancers and history/lore. So any suggestions on how to start this off and an interesting build would be extremely appreciated, as well as just general tips for a first time pen and paper player.

Thank you very much for your time,
Ner0

 

[Rampant]

Cleric with death and trickery domains.

 

[Derfmancher]

Undead bloodline Sorcerer, I think it fits the bill quite well.

 

[SteelDraco]

Hey guys,

I am new to pen and paper RPGs, though through video games (Neverwinter Nights Diamond Edition) I am a little familiar with how things work. I am completely new to the Pathfinder rule set though. I am starting a game with my uncle and his friends sometime this week and he is a veteran D&D and Warhammer player but is also new to Pathfinder.(One of his friends is the progeny of the ruleset change) The question is what kind of character do you recommend? The story is going to be something traditional high fantasy, male-oriented, rebel-rousing and all. I have an idea of what I want to do, but a little experience and some suggestions would be nice.

I want to play a quick-witted, smart alec, chaotic neutral, something. I want to be charismatic and be able to talk my way out of sticky situations. I am leaning more towards human, and I am wanting to go the spell casting route and I am a huge fan of necromancers and history/lore. So any suggestions on how to start this off and an interesting build would be extremely appreciated, as well as just general tips for a first time pen and paper player.

Thank you very much for your time,
Ner0

Charismatic plus spellcasting suggests bard to me. Chaotic Neutral is a pretty common bard alignment. Human is always a good race for pretty much any class, but feat-starved bards and rogues benefit even more from the bonus feat than classes that get lots of bonus feats.

Bards in Pathfinder tend to be good at social skills and increasing the effectiveness of other party members. They can really make a big difference in the combat ability of a group by giving everyone one or more beneficial numerical boosts, usually called "buffs". They can also be excellent historians, so that's another thing you expressed interest in that they cover. Not much in the way of necromantic magic, though - that's best done by clerics and oracles, with wizards getting some of it, though generally slower than a divine spellcaster (clerics and oracles).

Bard - Pathfinder_OGC

There are several archetypes that might fit well for you if you like the idea of the bard. Archetypes are like character class themes that change how the base class works, customizing it to fit a slightly different role.

The arcane duelist is more combat-focused, trading some noncombat abilities and situational defensive abilities for some bonus combat-related feats and the ability to give his weapon magical properties. It might be something you'd like.

The archeologist trades out a lot of his ability to enhance the whole group for being somewhat more versatile and rogue-like himself - he's a less group-oriented bard that can act as a rogue in the party without much trouble, spotting traps and basically swapping out performance for rogue abilities. He keeps the magic, though, so he's quite versatile. Think Indiana Jones with some magic and luck powers.

Dirge Bard is somewhat necromancy focused, though I'm not sure I'd recommend it.

You might also look into the Inquisitor class from the Advanced Player's Guide. It's more of a mix of the rogue, cleric, and ranger - they can be effective at some social skills as well as melee or ranged combat. They have sort of a monster-hunter vibe to them - think undead hunters from Castlevania or witch hunters. They're fairly good at being self-sufficient, but I'm not sure I'd recommend them for a beginning player - most classes in the Advanced Player's Guide tend to be a bit complicated in play for a new player. Thus the name, I guess.

Inquisitor - Pathfinder_OGC

 

[Emperor_Ner0]

Thanks guys, any more suggestions is welcome. I am just going to have to see what the group decides first but I will keep these suggestions in mind.

 

[meien]

bards aren't bad and inquisitors are one of my favorites but for social stuff not much beats rogues. they get the most skills and they are solid in melee. they have some rogue talents that can give them a couple spells and if you take the skill use magic device you can use wands, scrolls, staves and other magic items to give you some taste of spells.

 

[Emperor_Ner0]

Okay, so here are what is going on as far as I know. (I called the GM and told him about PCGen and he informed me on the other classes) There is a ranger, a psionics user, and a couple of melee users, and I think a rouge. He said that a spellcaster would be a nice addition to the party and he suggested going with a wizard. I also discovered we are playing a mixture of 3.5 and Pathfinders rules. (Not sure exactly what yet, as the session is probably going to be Sunday) I am trying to decide between a bard and a wizard. A bard sounds pretty awesome from what I have read, but I think the party would benefit more from a wizard and with a wizard I can go with necromancy. (No one has a paladin as a PC.)

 

[Empirate]

Unfortunately, Wizards, while very powerful and versatile, require a lot of system knowledge to work successfully. Spell selection and tactics come into play big time for a Wizard. If you think you can pull off some on-the-job training, you'll still be fine though - it's not as if you have to know the game inside and out. But expect to put in a little effort, like reading through all the spell descriptions and deciding which ones are worthwhile, and thinking a bit about the role you want to take in combat (buffer, battlefield controller, debuffer, blaster, summoner etc.).

Furthermore, Wizards, even Necromancy specialists, aren't very good at the classic approach to necromancy: create a horde of undead and send them into the fray. That job is better left to the cleric. I guess you could just play a summoning focused wizard and reflavor the creatures you summon, but it probably won't be the same.

That said, Wizard necromancers ARE very good at debuffing, and this can be a very effective combat role. At low levels, spells like Scare, Ghoul Touch, or Ray of Exhaustion are quite good, and a bit later on there's Fear, Enervation and Magic Jar. Mix and match with generally powerful battlefield control spells like Web, Stinking Cloud, Wall of Force etc., and the rest of your party should have no trouble taking out even very dangerous foes - while you hang back and make it all possible.


HOWEVER, Wizards really forego the "skilled" part of your dream character. You'll load up on a ton of knowledge skills, but other than that, you'll have Spellcraft and Fly, and a few ranks in essential cross-class skills like Perception. That's it. Also, a necromancer Wizard isn't really comfortable when he needs to act self-sustained. His forte is disabling the opposition, so others have an easier time dealing with them.



Bards pick up some nice buffs, debuffs, and battlefield control, so they can fill a similar niche. Load up on Glitterdust, Pyrotechnics, Haste, and Slow, and your Bard can have great impact on the way a fight will go - especially when you also bring the music. However, Bards lack casting stamina and variety compared to Wizards - they only learn a few spells, which need to be really well chosen. Here's a different side to system mastery that might be needed for playing an effective Bard.

Bards can be rather powerful warriors, on the other hand, so they needn't be casting all the time when there's a combat. IMHO archer Bards work rather well, since archery is a very potent combat style in PF in general, and all the Bard's buffs affect himself, as well. It would seem your group has that angle covered, though.

They also make up for a lack of spellcasting quite a bit with skills. Bards are the best skillmonkeys in PF in my opinion. But they won't beat the Wizard for sheer utility: think Mount, Knock, Shatter, Protection from Energy, Fly, Tongues, Darkvision, Ropetrick, Teleport etc., which the Bard can't possibly cover in their entirety. If I were your group, I'd probably want that kind of utility - especially since it is so easy for Wizards to always have the right scroll ready even if they haven't memorized a particular spell.


So all in all, I'd personally lean towards Wizard for sheer power and (potentially!) unmatched versatility. However, you should play what you feel comfortable with, and Bard can certainly be made to work just fine with your group. If the Rogue doesn't pick up those skills, a Bard might be needed very much for the social side of things!

 

[Herobizkit]

Well, Sorcerers can be great at RP situations with their high Charisma provided you can find some Talents and/or a Bloodline that gives you access to said Social skills.

Also, no spell memorization! Point 'n shoot!

 

[Empirate]

Well, Sorcerers can be great at RP situations with their high Charisma provided you can find some Talents and/or a Bloodline that gives you access to said Social skills.

Also, no spell memorization! Point 'n shoot!

I wouldn't recommend Sorcerer. I believe it takes much more system knowledge than Wizard to be effective. Spell didn't work so well? Memorize something different then! Oh, you're a Sorcerer, so you're stuck with that spell in your extremely limited selection forever! Bad luck, son.

Also, at least a Wizard has good Int, so he'll have some skillpoints. A Sorcerer will often have only 2 or so skillpoints per level: favored class benefit likely goes into HP and Int is a dump stat (Cha>Con>Dex>Wis>Int>Str). You'll likely want Spellcraft and Knowledge (Arcana). So being the social guy doesn't really work out for a Sorcerer, despite the high Cha.