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<blockquote data-quote="Greg K" data-source="post: 6567374" data-attributes="member: 5038"><p>Edit: Somehow i clicked on Minigiant's post and pasted my reply to a post by TrippyHippy after my previous reply timed about before submitting.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm all for interesting personalities and motivations for characters. You need them if you want to play when I run. However, they don't mechanically support the character concept and, therefore, are irrelevant to the conversation.</p><p></p><p>Some people think using the existing framework and squinting is good enough. To myself, and others (most importantly those with whom I game), it is not. As far as I am concerned, some concepts are strong enough archetypes that deserve their own classes without shoehorning them into existing classes and subclasses. The existing framework often requires squinting, because too many things are hard coded into the existing classes bringing baggage that should not be there and other things need to be changed as early as level 1 even with subclasses and backgrounds. When the hoop jumping that is multi-classing is required, the problem just gets worse (my opinion of course).</p><p>I am not saying that backgrounds and subclasses do not have their place as they do. I just think that some things are better handled by a new class with its own subclasses including Shamans, Witches, the 3e OA Shaman (which can have its own archetypes per an issue of Dragon Magazine with class variants), a Warrior-Mage base class, and the Light armored Fighter (along the lines of Khaalis's <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/rpgdownloads.php?do=download&downloadid=1124" target="_blank">Light Armored Fighter variant</a>). Similarly, I want an official non-mystical, non-spellcasting light armored ranger base class that is an unparalleled outdoorsman, because it is a common fantasy archetype.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Greg K, post: 6567374, member: 5038"] Edit: Somehow i clicked on Minigiant's post and pasted my reply to a post by TrippyHippy after my previous reply timed about before submitting. I'm all for interesting personalities and motivations for characters. You need them if you want to play when I run. However, they don't mechanically support the character concept and, therefore, are irrelevant to the conversation. Some people think using the existing framework and squinting is good enough. To myself, and others (most importantly those with whom I game), it is not. As far as I am concerned, some concepts are strong enough archetypes that deserve their own classes without shoehorning them into existing classes and subclasses. The existing framework often requires squinting, because too many things are hard coded into the existing classes bringing baggage that should not be there and other things need to be changed as early as level 1 even with subclasses and backgrounds. When the hoop jumping that is multi-classing is required, the problem just gets worse (my opinion of course). I am not saying that backgrounds and subclasses do not have their place as they do. I just think that some things are better handled by a new class with its own subclasses including Shamans, Witches, the 3e OA Shaman (which can have its own archetypes per an issue of Dragon Magazine with class variants), a Warrior-Mage base class, and the Light armored Fighter (along the lines of Khaalis's [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/rpgdownloads.php?do=download&downloadid=1124"]Light Armored Fighter variant[/URL]). Similarly, I want an official non-mystical, non-spellcasting light armored ranger base class that is an unparalleled outdoorsman, because it is a common fantasy archetype. [/QUOTE]
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