Clerics need a wis of 20.

[Vaeron]

I have done 3 encounters so far with KotS and the cleric has a very hard time making a difference in combat (outside his Healing Words). He really needs some sort of proficiency bonus or something.

I agree... The cleric has an almost impossible time making his hit rolls. Makes him waste his encounter ability and the healing surge that would otherwise have triggered. A healing prayer wasted because it was tied to a +3 vs AC hit roll. When you're fighting a monster with AC 18, and your to-hit is only +3, and it's your encounter-only power, that's a problem. And a miss means no healing surge. With a roll of 15 required, that's a 75% chance of missing.

 

[Cadfan]

I agree... The cleric has an almost impossible time making his hit rolls. Makes him waste his encounter ability and the healing surge that would otherwise have triggered. A healing prayer wasted because it was tied to a +3 vs AC hit roll. When you're fighting a monster with AC 18, and your to-hit is only +3, and it's your encounter-only power, that's a problem. And a miss means no healing surge. With a roll of 15 required, that's a 75% chance of missing.

While I agree with this, it has to be pointed out that the KotS cleric is... not well optimized. He doesn't hit often when using his mace, but he doesn't do poorly at all when attacking with Wisdom v Will using his prayers. That same AC 18 monster is likely to have a Will somewhere around a 14, and a cleric attacking with an 18 wisdom and no magical implement hits that about 50/50. That cleric would have done better with Cause Fear, or some similar prayer.

 

[Mal Malenkirk]

You forget that not all powers are WIS based.

Looking at Erais from the pregen, Priest Shield is basically a melee attack using STR (He gets +4 from his STR + Proficiency). There are probably more, given the existence of a warpriest paragon path.

I also wouldn't be surprised if the AC bonus granted by the spell wasn't tie to his CHA.

Speaking of Erais, if he had 20 wis, tell me where he would take the points? His other stats are low enough as they are.

 

[hong]

The main reason for maxing out Wis (and Int for wizards) in previous editions was because of the all-or-nothing nature of instakill spells. If your spell can take out the enemy in one go, or do nothing, then a lot depends on hitting.

Instakills no longer exist, so the cleric and wiz have been brought back to the same baseline as everybody else. Thus the incentive for maxing out Wis/Int should be pretty much the same as for fighters maxing Str, rogues maxing Dex, etc.

 

[Rechan]

The main reason for maxing out Wis (and Int for wizards) in previous editions was because of the all-or-nothing nature of instakill spells.

Well, it was also because you had to have your DCs super high to contend with elevated monster Saves. And for the bonus spells.

 

[Stalker0]

Buying an 18 will cost you 20 of your 25 points. Buying a 16 would have only cost you 12.

Getting a 20 wisdom is nice. That's why it costs a whole freaking lot.

The OP does make the point that a +2 to wis is a better benefit to a 4e cleric than a 3e one, because he does literally use it all the time.

However, there's a lot of evidence to suggest that WOTC has changed the point buy slightly. Now, an 18 takes EVEN MORE points to get, meaning while the benefit of having an 18 is good, the cost is more.

 

[Scholar & Brutalman]

Shouldn't every 4e class benefit in the same way from a high primary stat? They all have the same power progression and their powers all have much better effects when they hit rather than miss. Why is the 4e cleric exceptional?

 

[Voss]

Shouldn't every 4e class benefit in the same way from a high primary stat? They all have the same power progression and their powers all have much better effects when they hit rather than miss. Why is the 4e cleric exceptional?

Mostly just because the KotS cleric was built so poorly. His encounter power is almost a complete waste, and his at will powers do nothing at all if they miss. The character is largely designed to be behind the back line, supporting the front rank with short range powers. However, being saddled with a melee power, based off his tertiary stat, is an amazingly poor choice.

The fighter also suffers a bit for not having an 18, but his inherent +1 to attack rolls for being a fighter makes it look better.

 

[loseth]

Thus the incentive for maxing out Wis/Int should be pretty much the same as for fighters maxing Str, rogues maxing Dex, etc.

Unfortunately not so, IME. I've only played Escape from Sembia, but in that adventure, I got the impression that defences were tough to hit relative to 3e. To mitigate this, fighters & paladins get their class attack bonus (+1) and weapon proficiencies (+1-3) added to their attack rolls. This makes them viable even if they don't get +5 attack from their prime stat. In contrast, the cleric (at least from what we've seen) gets neither weapon proficiency* or class attack bonus. Thus, if the cleric doesn't get +5 from his main attack stat (WIS), he's going to be missing everything but the proverbial broad side of a barn door. Actually, he might even miss that.

All in all, I'm very disappointed with the cleric as we've seen him so far. Hopefully, the pregen cleric was just a bad build and the PHB will allow us to either make clerics that are better at melee or make ones that can get early bonuses to their magic attacks from sources other than WIS.

*Weapon proficiency wouldn't actually help anyway, because he's useless at melee.

 

[small pumpkin man]

Unfortunately not so, IME. I've only played Escape from Sembia, but in that adventure, I got the impression that defences were tough to hit relative to 3e. To mitigate this, fighters & paladins get their class attack bonus (+1) and weapon proficiencies (+1-3) added to their attack rolls. This makes them viable even if they don't get +5 attack from their prime stat. In contrast, the cleric (at least from what we've seen) gets neither weapon proficiency* or class attack bonus. Thus, if the cleric doesn't get +5 from his main attack stat (WIS), he's going to be missing everything but the proverbial broad side of a barn door. Actually, he might even miss that.

All in all, I'm very disappointed with the cleric as we've seen him so far. Hopefully, the pregen cleric was just a bad build and the PHB will allow us to either make clerics that are better at melee or make ones that can get early bonuses to their magic attacks from sources other than WIS.

*Weapon proficiency wouldn't actually help anyway, because he's useless at melee.

Weapon prof doesn't help as much as you seem to think, since half the time it just offsets the bonus of armour because weapons attack AC as default and implement powers attack ref/will as default. The Cleric should be hitting with Lance of Faith as much as the Halfing Paladin from D&DXP was hitting with his powers, and only slightly less than the KotB Dwarven Fighter.