Combat Speed Tips

[Simplicity]

Wow. A guy posts asking for help and the response he gets is: "Don't focus on combat so much." Real helpful.

Combat speed tips:
- Combat Pad from Gamemastery. Once you roll initiative, you can put the ordering out there for everyone to see. That alone will speed things up dramatically. Personally, I'm seriously considering FORCING initiative to go clockwise around the table. Realism is almost not worth the pain of everyone trying to figure out who goes next every round. Really, this is the #1 most important thing in a large group. Most of the time consumed is consumed by your players, not you. So you need to keep them focused on the combat and moving quickly.

- Roll to hit and damage at the same time. If you miss, ignore the damage.

- Roll a d20 a bunch of times ahead of time. Write it down on paper (no cheating). Now everytime you need a d20 roll, just cross it off. Players may catch on that you're not rolling. Explain or not. Rule 0, baby. Probably should not combine this with much actually rolling though because looking ahead means you might opt on on 1s for your big attacks.

- As the DM, have sticky notes with each players defenses/Perception. Keep those inside your DM screen. (you can even have them in the direction of the player on the inside of the screen). So you don't have to keep asking. Helps when there's a secret door you don't want them to know about. Just look at Perception and tick off a d20 roll.

- Try to get people to be ready on their turns. Good luck with that one though.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Roll Initiaive for group of monsters, instead of each individually. Especially useful if you're using monsters of the same type, or if monsters have identical initiative modifiers. But don't shy away from modifying the numbers (use the lower, if you want to keep fair).

This makes the initiative order simpler.

Prepare your NPCs & monsters well. Have a standard combat strategy written up. Note the spells they are most likely to cast, and have the spell descriptions memorized or ready. (This can be a lot of "homework". But it might be better then the players seeing you skimming through rule-books to find the best spell)

Eyeball movement cost. If you notice that backtracking of steps after finding out that you have 5 ft to little movement if you go Route A takes too long or happens to often, just guess if it should work. Make people aware that Attack of Opportunities aren't the end of the world and you don't have to squeeze every 5 ft of your movement. (if both sides keep to this, this means both NPCs and PCs provoke more, and it probably evens out in the long run). 1-1-1 diagonals are sins against Euclidean geometry, but great for gameplay, BTW.

Learn to mark conditions and effects going on, either on minis, aside from your NPC hit pint tables, or on an initiative board.

Players should learn to pre-write their different buff states. (Typically in form of tables listing the applicable effects and the final attack/damage/hp values)

Option for average damage. If you don't want to roll 8d6 points of damage, take the average. Or build the average of a part of the dice rolled and roll the remaining part.

 

[drjones]

1. Talk louder than your players

2. Make them hurry up.

3. Stand up.

Doing a big combat can be like herding cats so you better be ready to herd the hell out of them.

It's nice to be polite but everyone will appreciate it if you interrupt now and then when people take too long. My guys love to try to work out the exact optimal damage plan 3 turns in advance so I have to cut them off often, especially if they are tipsy. Sad thing is they would play better & faster if they just concentrated fire and didn't worry about 'losing' damage by overkilling things.

 

[Lindorie]

Wow! Great comments and suggestions. Thanks. This is a long reply, but there's a lot of good content in this thread.

Without knowing what on God's green Earth you were doing for those five hours, I've got nothing.

LOL. Quite apropos.

I was summarizing what had happened to a few of the characters based on a short introduction game with my kids. This group decided to pick up from there. Shortly afterward, the storyline had a large group of guards and a wizard challenge the group, which was in "a wrong place at the wrong time". I let everyone know that I intended this encounter to be a introduction to Skill Challenges, and that they should work out how the group wanted to handle the situation. I tried to get everyone in the group involved, without success. One character kept wanting to try to use their thievery skills, but a couple of the stronger personalities kept shutting him down (my fault). After a few skill checks, by a minority of the players, one of the characters started pushing a fight.

Player says, "d&d is all about combat". DM response, "Okay, you draw your sword, what do the rest of you want to do?"

This was the main DM problem. Although I redirected the one player a couple of times, when he told the guards to "either drop your weapons or fight", I had them fight. In hindsight, that wasn't fair to the other players.

it sounds like you got bushwhacked

Only in the sense that I didn't expect this to be a fight; it was a Skill Challenge, after all. I used the stats from Second Son (I think) and only used basic attacks for the guards. The NPC turns tended to be over quickly.

how familiar were you with the rules

Have a standard combat strategy written up

I've been scouring the web for 4e rules for a while. I spend 3-4 weeks just working on the first adventure, getting an idea of the world environment, major characters, etc. I don't think that's a problem.

pre-roll damage

A few of you mentioned this. I now recall that they were using my dice, of which I only have 3 or 4 full sets. I recall hearing, several times, calls for "someone pass me an 8 sided die".

have sticky notes with each players defenses/Perception.

Another good idea. It would shave off some time for my turns. The main advantage, though, is that when I have to keep asking for metagaming information, I have a harder time weaving storyline into combat. In other words, it becomes much more a straight "guard 1 hits you for N damage".

did everyone spend 5 minutes per action reading their character sheet?

I think this one thing, that several of you mentioned, was the key. There was a lot of "ummmm..." going on when someone's turn came up. Simplicity mentioned an initiative pad, which might help. It would at least allow someone to see when their turn is coming up, perhaps helping encourage them to get ready.
I'm not sure where they picked up the habit, since two of them were new to D&D, but three of them were keeping careful track of how many hitpoints of damage was done to each enemy, which also slowed things down at times as they consulted with each other.

Which reminds me, do you give the enemy AC out at the start of the encounter? I find myself not wanting to tell the players. I think I've decided to tell them the first time someone scores a successful hit.

It's nice to be polite but everyone will appreciate it if you interrupt now and then when people take too long

There were a few times when I did this. The players involved got really frustrated that they couldn't finish their turns, so I stopped interrupting. I haven't decided which is the right way to go, since I want the newbies to keep playing. BTW: "like herding cats" is exactly how I felt.

Roll Initiative for group of monsters, instead of each individually if monsters have identical initiative modifiers

Another suggestion I'll probably incorporate.

Combat Pad from Gamemastery. Once you roll initiative, you can put the ordering out there for everyone to see. That alone will speed things up dramatically. Personally, I'm seriously considering FORCING initiative to go clockwise around the table. Realism is almost not worth the pain of everyone trying to figure out who goes next every round. Really, this is the #1 most important thing in a large group. Most of the time consumed is consumed by your players, not you. So you need to keep them focused on the combat and moving quickly.

So, in summary, the top points to me are:
1) Have your actions ready/know your character sheets (dm enforced time limits?)
2) A set of dice for each player
3) Roll damage at the same time as the attack rolls.
4) Viewable initiative order
5) Be lenient on ranges (avoid a lot of time counting squares)

 

[Jack99]

Roll Initiative for group of monsters, instead of each individually if monsters have identical initiative modifiers

Another suggestion I'll probably incorporate.

You should reconsider this. While it does save some time, it makes combats with multiple foes unbalanced. Basically it creates a problem because they all get to act at the same time, without any player being able to interfere, for example via healing or other things. It makes for some odd combats.

I found that using a simple Word-table, where I have the names of players and foes alike, I then plot in the initiative modifier of the NPCs before the game start. When combat starts, I plot in the PC's initiate, and then I use the "sort" function. Has done wonders for me to keep track, and thus the players. Of course, this only works if you have a laptop at your disposal at the gaming table, but I thought I would mention it.

In general, you can use a timer. I don't personally like the timer, but instead, I simply wait a little bit, mostly to see if there are any questions, then start counting down from 10. If the player hasn't stated his action before I reach 0, he forfeits his turn.

Cheers

 

[WanderingMonster]

If you have a laptop available for playing, InitTool from rptools.net is a great time saver. I can be done on the fly, or if you prep combatants ahead of time, it's value increases dramatically.

Using the Players Roll All the Dice option doesn't necessarily speed up combat, but it gets everyone engaged in the combat itself. I haven't really polled the players on how they like it, but so far no one has complained, and they all know what's going on even when it's not their turn.

 

[Derren]

The most important thing is that you teach your players to plan their actions while the other players are still taking they turns. Nothing slows a game down more than players who only start to think when their turn comes up (except maybe having to look up rules).

 

[Iron Sky]

Only in the sense that I didn't expect this to be a fight; it was a Skill Challenge, after all. I used the stats from Second Son (I think) and only used basic attacks for the guards. The NPC turns tended to be over quickly.

I can't tell you how many times I've had the 3.x equivalent of Skill Challenges become combat.

A few of you mentioned this. I now recall that they were using my dice, of which I only have 3 or 4 full sets. I recall hearing, several times, calls for "someone pass me an 8 sided die".

That will slow things down. One of my players has a wizard in my 3.5 game and until recently insisted on rolling his 8-10 die of spell damage one at a time...

I think this one thing, that several of you mentioned, was the key. There was a lot of "ummmm..." going on when someone's turn came up. Simplicity mentioned an initiative pad, which might help. It would at least allow someone to see when their turn is coming up, perhaps helping encourage them to get ready.

Even worse is when people don't even pay attention to what's going on so on half the players turns you have to redescribe the whole battle to them(one of the things that made me switch to playing with a grid rather than narrative combat). Our group is experienced enough that this one isn't much of a problem anymore in 3.5, but there have been times where the 10 or 5 second rule has been in effect.

I'm not sure where they picked up the habit, since two of them were new to D&D, but three of them were keeping careful track of how many hitpoints of damage was done to each enemy, which also slowed things down at times as they consulted with each other.

If they are consulting when it's their turn, I'd definitely use the 10-second rule. You could also let them know that you will let them know when things are bloodied so they don't have to keep track of it. That might help.

Which reminds me, do you give the enemy AC out at the start of the encounter? I find myself not wanting to tell the players. I think I've decided to tell them the first time someone scores a successful hit.

I never give out AC. In longer fights, the PCs usually figure it out though:

Player 1: "That hits AC 24"
Me: "Miss."
Player 2: "AC 28"
Me: "Hit"
Player 2(to the group): "Ok, its AC is between 24 and 28"
Player 3: "AC 25"
Me: "Hit"
Players: "Ahah, AC 25 guys"

There were a few times when I did this. The players involved got really frustrated that they couldn't finish their turns, so I stopped interrupting. I haven't decided which is the right way to go, since I want the newbies to keep playing. BTW: "like herding cats" is exactly how I felt.

If you just started doing it, I could see it seeming arbitrary. If you make it a rule and do it for everyone, it'll be part of the game rather than an "individually targetted DM ability."

So, in summary, the top points to me are:
1) Have your actions ready/know your character sheets (dm enforced time limits?)
2) A set of dice for each player
3) Roll damage at the same time as the attack rolls.
4) Viewable initiative order
5) Be lenient on ranges (avoid a lot of time counting squares)

I'd agree with the first 4. On 5, with 4E's elimination of the "1 2 1 2" rule, I don't see counting ranges taking that much time. Most fights will probably have an average engagement range of no more than 10 squares since most classes don't have many abilities with more range than that and those that do get advantages for positioning themselves well.

 

[drjones]

You should reconsider this. While it does save some time, it makes combats with multiple foes unbalanced. Basically it creates a problem because they all get to act at the same time, without any player being able to interfere, for example via healing or other things. It makes for some odd combats.

I have tried this a few different ways and my best result has been a hybrid, I separate the monsters into groups that get their own initiative. The easiest way was to go by monster type since they all have the same init modifier. So for Raiders I had Archers on one init, wizard on his own, soldiers on another init. I can't imagine you will often have more than 4 or 5 monster types max and if you have less than that you can give them their own init to mix things up more.

I am sure this is obvious to most DMs but without direction in the limited 4ed rules I have seen I had to work it out myself.

 

[drjones]

Which reminds me, do you give the enemy AC out at the start of the encounter? I find myself not wanting to tell the players. I think I've decided to tell them the first time someone scores a successful hit.

Nah if they care enough they can work it out themselves. Since 4th ed has 4 target values I did give some hints if they said they were specifically trying to figure out which to go after. Not numbers but things like 'The soldiers are wearing heavy armor so they move a bit slower'.