Combat very swingy

[DLichen]

Is it just me or is the intentional design choice of setting the average hitpoint at ~50% making combats very swingy?

I didn't really notice it when 4e first came out, but after a few weeks of running it the problem seems to be quite severe.

PCs rolling badly or NPCs rolling well tilts encounters unreasonably far towards certain sides. This doesn't help given high damage potential monsters like fire beatles or guard drakes. I put my PCs into what should have been an "easy" encounter, but because of good rolls on an alpha strike, one character died on the first round and then the situation became much much worse.

On the other side of the coin, combat can also become boring snorefests when both sides missing alot.

Just wondering if I was the only one having this problem or if others have noticed it as well.

 

[Daniel D. Fox]

Is it just me or is the intentional design choice of setting the average hitpoint at ~50% making combats very swingy?

I didn't really notice it when 4e first came out, but after a few weeks of running it the problem seems to be quite severe.

PCs rolling badly or NPCs rolling well tilts encounters unreasonably far towards certain sides. This doesn't help given high damage potential monsters like fire beatles or guard drakes. I put my PCs into what should have been an "easy" encounter, but because of good rolls on an alpha strike, one character died on the first round and then the situation became much much worse.

On the other side of the coin, combat can also become boring snorefests when both sides missing alot.

Just wondering if I was the only one having this problem or if others have noticed it as well.

I thought this was an issue at first, but it was mostly due to that the PCs weren't adding their proficiency bonus to hit with their weapons.

 

[Mouseferatu]

I've been in a few 4E combats where a handful of bad rolls on one side or the other made all the difference, yes.

But the same thing happened in 3E, and 2E, and 1E, and Vampire, and...

I think it's just a fact of RPG combat. I certainly don't find it to be a bigger issue with 4E than anywhere else, and less of an issue than with some.

 

[fba827]

So far, in my own experience, it hasn't been an issue. Sure, it will happen once in a while due to continuous lucky/sucky rolls ... but that is to be the case in any game of chance (improbable? yes, unimpossible? no).

Because everyone has more hit points, the encounters last longer so you have more chance to notice a "full round of 'crap'" but I wouldn't call it a universal truth on swinginess for the system.

 

[WhatGravitas]

I also had that experience - but also made the experience that good tactics (flanking, synergies, creative stunting) really help to turn the tide. Since the hit chances are so balanced, these minor benefits are *very* powerful and tip the scales very easily.

For example, solo monsters in confined spaces (where the PCs cannot manoeuvre effectively), are much more dangerous. Killing minions first really helps the PCs immensely to avoid the subsequent flanks. So... tactics matter - a lot.

EDIT: Another tactic is a strategic retreat. In 4E, it can actually work, since run speed is so high, whereas charging is slow!

Cheers, LT.

 

[RangerWickett]

One of my friends has successfully petitioned to be allowed to roll 3d6 instead of d20 for all his rolls. Whereas before he had an unnatural ability to roll below 6 90% of the time, now he averages more like 9 (which is still below average, but good enough to hit from time to time).

 

[Stalker0]

In 4e combat, players tend to get hurt at lot faster than before, but they also have the ability to recover quicker than before.

I have definitely been knocked out more times in 4e combats, but I was able to get back up and continue.

So far I can't say I've noticed that big swingy trend.

 

[Spatula]

Adding up dice (2d10, 3d6, 5d4, etc.) instead of a flat roll is actually a really good way to fix swinginess in combat, if that's really what you want. Although it will make crits much more rare.

 

[Intrope]

One of my friends has successfully petitioned to be allowed to roll 3d6 instead of d20 for all his rolls. Whereas before he had an unnatural ability to roll below 6 90% of the time, now he averages more like 9 (which is still below average, but good enough to hit from time to time).

Funny, that was my exact thought on reading the first post!

I wonder though if that's actually a good idea. From what I've seen, I'd think that it would make Solos more difficult from making high target numbers nearly impossible--and make Solos above the party's level lethal. On the other hand, I can't see where it would change too much otherwise. Perhaps it would be enough to just treat all Solos as being higher level than they are listed as, to compensate.

 

[FireLance]

One way to mitigate swinginess is to roll individual initiative for all the PCs and the monsters. Combat becomes much more swingy when all or most of the monsters act one after the other without giving any of the PCs the chance to react.