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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cleon" data-source="post: 8489865" data-attributes="member: 57383">Well not that many 3E Oriental Adventure classes have ki abilities, unlike the 1E version where each class has its own ki power, sometimes in different levels.That said, some of the 1E powers are ported into 3E but just don't have "ki" in the names.Frustratingly, some of the powers don't have types in 3E - the Wu Jen's Sudden Action for example doesn't have (Ex) or (Su), for example. Also, some of the assignments don't make any sense to me - like why is a Eunuch Warlock's Mighty Spells an Extraordinary ability. It affects spells and is somehow nonmagical?Let's run through the book.Core Classes  (3E Oriental Adventures)<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Samurai - the Ki Shout and Great Ki Shout feat mentioned as a Bonus Feat option, that's.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sohei - Ki Frenzy (Ex or Su not listed).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wu Jen - Sudden Action (Ex or Su not listed).</li> </ul>Prestige Classes  (3E Oriental Adventures)<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Henshin Mystic - Ki Strike (Su).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Iaijutsu Master - flavour text has "harness their ki energy to strike with blinding speed and devastating power" but  ALL of their class powers are (Ex) and don't mention ki in their descriptions.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ninja Spy - flavour text mentions "strange ki powers" but only Ki Breath (Ex) specifically mentions ki.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Singh Rager - gets Great Ki Shout feat. Roaring Strike (Ex) allows free action use of the Ki Shout feat.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Weapon Master (Kensei) - flavour about seeking "perfection of ki" in mastery of a melee weapon. Have Ki Damage (Ex), Ki Critical (Ex or Su not listed)* and Ki Whirlwind Attack (Ex). * Ki Critical just gives the Improved Critical feat for free or boost an existing Improved Critical's threat range, which sounds (Ex) to me.</li> </ul>And that's all of them!So we've only got one (Su) specifically typed, the Ki Strike, which is the same as the Monk's ability. Everything else is either untyped or (Ex).The Ninja Spy does have a bunch of (Su) abilities, namely Acrobatics, Leap of the Clouds, Hide in Plain Sight, Water Walk, Thousand Faces, Poison Immunity and Abundant Step.Some of those are presumably the "strange ki powers" the flavour text mentions.So the 3E book has a mixture of both (Ex) and (Su).Let's see, we have:Seven Swords  (3E Enworld Conversions)<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The General - Kiai (Su) - I'm OK keeping this Supernatural, mostly due to the stunning effect.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The Screaming Child - Sudden Action (Ex or Su not listed) - might as well leave that untyped to match the 3E version.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The Paper Warrior - Ki Push (Ex), Ki Resilience (Ex) and Ki Speed (Ex) - I'm fine making Ki Push (Su) but would keep the others (Ex).</li> </ul>Ki Speed is similar to a Singh Rager extraordinary ability, incidentally:Swiftness of the Lioness (Ex): When she reaches 7th level, a singh rager can act as if under the effects of a haste spell for a total of 1 round per class level per day. These rounds need not be consecutive.I like that "These rounds need not be consecutive," so how about incorporating that into the Paper Warrior's Ki Speed?Proposed change:Ki Push (Su): As a standard action, the Paper Warrior can point a finger and direct ki power at a single opponent within a range of 10 feet. The Paper Warrior makes a +8 ranged touch attack, and if the ki power hits the opponent must succeed at a DC 16 Fortitude save or be hurled 10 feet away from the Paper Warrior and fall prone, taking 1d6 points of damage. Ki Speed (Ex): The Paper Warrior can muster its inner power to move with superhuman speed, acting as if under the effects of a haste spell for a total of 5 rounds per day. These rounds need not be consecutive. This ability modifies the Paper Warrior's statistics to the following:Incidentally, Ki Shout is quite different in 3E from the 1E samurai ability - it can cause the shaken condition in nearby opponents, while Great Ki Shout can cause the panicked condition. Since it's a feat it doesn't specify whether it's an (Ex) or (Su) effect.</blockquote>

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