Counterspelling

[Antoine]

A couple counter question :

1/ Let's say I'm a Wiz9 with improved counterspell.
I walk into a room.
Bad nasty druid is in the middle of casting a spell.
Passing DC 19 spellcraft check, I get he reincarnating bigger baddy (10 min. casting time).
I got baleful polymorph (5th level transmutation spell prepared).
Can I counter bad nasty druid's reincarnate (4th level transmutation).
How long does it take ?

2/ Now I'm nice friendly Drd7 with improved counterspell. Spot evil wizard and make spellcraft check to see he's casting nasty haste on his pals. Got reincarnate prepared. Can I counter his haste (3rd level transmutation) ?
How long does it take ?

Thanks for your help. Please split home rules from core rules.

 

[The Souljourner]

I don't think you can counter a spell that's already been started. The description of counterspell says you ready an action, and it goes off just as soon as the opponent starts to cast his spell. In the first case, he's already started, so it's too late.

Countspell says you ready an action to cast the spell... which is interesting, because that implies that you can't counterspell with a spell that has a longer than 1 standard action casting time (since that's all you can do in a readied action).

That seems to be the way the rules are written... I'm not sure if that was the intention, however.

-The Souljourner

 

[Antoine]

Countspell says you ready an action to cast the spell... which is interesting, because that implies that you can't counterspell with a spell that has a longer than 1 standard action casting time (since that's all you can do in a readied action).

So no counterspelling sleep at low levels with another sleep, nor any of the summon monster X with the same ?

Tough !

 

[mikebr99]

So no counterspelling sleep at low levels with another sleep, nor any of the summon monster X with the same ?

Tough !

Sure can... you are just using a part of the spell as a counter ("altering it" as PHB suggests). You don't need everything the spell can do when you are countering with it, just the spell energy.


Mike

 

[Antoine]

You don't need everything the spell can do when you are countering with it, just the spell energy.

Then back to the cases a the start of the post… How'd you rule ?

 

[mikebr99]

Then back to the cases a the start of the post… How'd you rule ?

1) No... because the caster has already started his casting.

To use a counterspell, you must select an opponent as the target of the counterspell. You do this by choosing the ready action. In doing so, you elect to wait to complete your action until your opponent tries to cast a spell. (You may still move your speed, since ready is a standard action.)

If the target of your counterspell tries to cast a spell, make a Spellcraft check (DC 15 + the spell’s level). This check is a free action. If the check succeeds, you correctly identify the opponent’s spell and can attempt to counter it. If the check fails, you can’t do either of these things. To complete the action, you must then cast the correct spell. As a general rule, a spell can only counter itself. If you are able to cast the same spell and you have it prepared (if you prepare spells), you cast it, altering it slightly to create a counterspell effect. If the target is within range, both spells automatically negate each other with no other results.​

​

2)Yes (assuming the ready action was initiated by the druid before the enemy caster started), because the imp. counterspell feat lets you use a spell from the same school that is 1 or more levels higher to counter.​

And countering a spell is a standard action, despite what the durations of the full spell is.​

Mike​

 

[Antoine]

1) No... because the caster has already started his casting.

Then is you're there at the beginning of a 10 minutes casting, recognize the spell and successfully counter with a dispel or a higher-level-same-school-improved-counterspelling-one-action-CT-spell, you counter on the first round of the opponent's casting ?

 

[Antoine]

And countering a spell is a standard action, despite what the durations of the full spell is.

Assuming you mean CT when typing duration in the sentence above :

Then it's perfectly legal for a sorcerer to use a cantrip-heighten spell-improved counterspell combo to counter virtually anything ?

 

[mikebr99]

Then is you're there at the beginning of a 10 minutes casting, recognize the spell and successfully counter with a dispel or a higher-level-same-school-improved-counterspelling-one-action-CT-spell, you counter on the first round of the opponent's casting ?

correct... if you've "readied" to counter a spellcaster, and meet the countering prerequisites, the enemy's spell fizzles during his 1st round of casting... 1st few seconds actually.


Mike

 

[Squire James]

Assuming you mean CT when typing duration in the sentence above :

Then it's perfectly legal for a sorcerer to use a cantrip-heighten spell-improved counterspell combo to counter virtually anything ?

Nope! Adding a metamagic feat to a sorcerer spell is a full-round action, and full-round actions can't be readied.