CR ranges for Summon Monster I-IX?

[Mephistopheles]

That won't work, sorry. Natural weapon attacks simply fail.

Got a rules quote on that? Because the PHB says nothig of the sort.

Well, taking magic circle against evil as the example it doesn't state that, but it does state "All creatures within the area gain the effects of a protection from evil spell ...". Protection from Evil then states "... the spell prevents bodily contact by summoned creatures. This causes the natural weapon attacks of such creatures to fail and the creatures to recoil if such attacks require touching the warded creature. ... Spell resistance can allow a creature to overcome this protection and touch the warded creature.".

So, even if they don't need to enter the magic circle to attack the enemy they are still unable to attack it with natural weapons unless their spell resistance overcomes it. The best bet around this kind of protection is perhaps summoning creatures with alignments that match the protection and so are not subject to the warding, or creatures that don't rely on natural weapons and have the necessary reach. It looks like you'll have a good variety of creatures to choose from so you may be able to manage one or the other.

 

[Prism]

The Wastrilith from Fiend Folio is CR17 and can be summoned by a SM9 - but it has an oh so fun side effect

 

[Liquidsabre]

The best bet around this kind of protection is perhaps summoning creatures with alignments that match the protection and so are not subject to the warding, or creatures that don't rely on natural weapons and have the necessary reach.

I don't think the summoned creature's alignment will help. The Protection spell hedges out summoned creatures and I don't remember it having anything to do with alignment.

edit- Aha, caught it in the spell description. Good aligned creatures aren't affected by Prot. from Evil, never mind.

 

[Thanee]

ELH, open-ended rolls variant. Yes, a 1, followed by a low-ish roll, would fail.

Ah, ok.

That, actually, depends - if the person thenmoves (or is MOVED) towards one of the creatures - that voids the spell. ^_^ Remember the bit about pressing a hedging abjuration against somethgnit wards against ... ^_^

I wouldn't be too sure about the "is moved" part there, however.
If you willingly force the barrier upon the creature, you notice it and can stop, if you continue, it goes down. That certainly isn't the case, if you are moved in some way by an outside force.

Got a rules quote on that? Because the PHB says nothig of the sort.

Actually it does... just look up Protection from Evil.

Yes, but they take the damage normally required to kill them ... and that triggers the Jovoc's aura, which in turn hurts the enemy. ^_^

I must admit, I have no idea what a Jovoc is, but if that's kinda like the Balor explode-upon-death ability, it surely wouldn't trigger, since they simply are not killed. If it has some weird other trigger (other than being killed, that is), it might... dunno.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Mephistopheles]

I must admit, I have no idea what a Jovoc is, but if that's kinda like the Balor explode-upon-death ability, it surely wouldn't trigger, since they simply are not killed. If it has some weird other trigger (other than being killed, that is), it might... dunno.

A Jovoc (Monster Manual II, p58) is a nasty little demon that has a supernatural ability called Aura of Retribution. They're not hard to take out, but thanks to the aura whenever a Jovoc takes damage any creatures within a 30-foot spread of the Jovoc that are not demons take an equal amount of damage (Fort DC 15 for half), not subject to negation or reduction by resistances, immunities, damage reduction, spell resistance, etcetera.

 

[Thanee]

Ah, so they don't actually have to be killed, they just do that all the time.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Pax]

And especially since THESE Jovocs are Summoned, so they won't die ... they'll all just Coup De Grace their own selves - or something to that nature - to deal lots of retributive damage. ^_^

Were I a cleric-type, I'd do that with a Mass Harm or similar. "Oooo, look, eight Jovocs within thirty feet of you - I'll cast this ONE spell, they'll fail their saves voluntarily and each take 150 damage ... sucks to be you!" ^_^

But I'm not, so, oh well.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

If CR was that high (i.e. equal to your class level), then a single summon spell would double your fighting power, basically.

That would be very wrong!

Bye
Thanee

Not unsimilar to a Dominate Monster spell. (Sorry to bring this up again)

---

As a player, I would prefer Summon Monster to summon creatures as near as possible to my own CR/level.
But if the same applies for my enemies, I will defininetely hate it. Imagine a Wizard 4 levels above the party level - a dangerous (with a 50% chance of failure/success) encounter for the characters, but a not so unlikely situation for a . Now imagine he uses a Summoning Spell to call a creature with a CR 4 below his level - suddenly, there is a creature that is probably as dangerous as any single character of the group (and definitely at 100% HP, spells and so on). And the wizard might do this more than once in that combat. Sure, he won`t be able to cast his other nasty spells in that time, but it still sounds quite nasty.

Unfortunately, the current rules reduce the role of many summoned creatures to (weak) meat shields. Still of some use, certainly, and there are situation in which you really need someone to take the damage for you.
(In our current Eberron campaign and during our first adventure to the Mournlands, the Druids Summon Nature´s Ally spells were extremely valuable, considering the fact that we were three days away from ANY possible healing source.)

Mustrum Ridcully

 

[Thanee]

Dominate does only work with a creature of the appropriate CR around, and can be dispelled.

Bye
Thanee

 

[thorian]

And especially since THESE Jovocs are Summoned, so they won't die ... they'll all just Coup De Grace their own selves - or something to that nature - to deal lots of retributive damage. ^_^

Were I a cleric-type, I'd do that with a Mass Harm or similar. "Oooo, look, eight Jovocs within thirty feet of you - I'll cast this ONE spell, they'll fail their saves voluntarily and each take 150 damage ... sucks to be you!" ^_^

But I'm not, so, oh well.

I wouldn't allow them to do more damage than they can take, which to me, is limited by their hit points. If they only have 30 hit points, then they can not take more than that.