Creating a Divine Spellbook

[strongbow]

Ok, so I'm hearing two arguments from my original post here:

D)A cleric, if given access to a non-domain only spell not normally on his/her class list, can put that spell into a divine spellbook, and prepare it without a spellbook. (A slight variation from this. The spell does not neccesarily have to make it into a formal spellbook. The difference is minor)
G) You sick fool, divine casters can't do anything except their own independent research. Nice try.

Now I would like to throw a wrinkle into the mix. Since divine casters have to follow the rules for arcane writings, they have to have some writing of the spell at some point. One argument is that they can scribe the new, non-base class list spell into spellbook format. This way, an independent researcher could allow the spell to be copied without having to make scroll after scroll.

If the above holds true, then could a divine caster, following the rules for arcane preparation, memorize a spell from a borrowed divine "magical writing", which appears to be a simple re-naming of a spellbook,(contingent on a successful Spellcraft check) and then make his her own divine "magical writings" with that spell Keep in mind that divine casters are supposed to make these "magical writings" per their own rules.

By the way, I have been asking for the technical explanation here because I play in Living Greyhawk. With no DMs to provide some common sense to everything, one must go with the technical rules in the tournament format. Thanks for the posts, and keep the discussion rolling.

I understand some posters concern with a "slippery slope", and agree. The Living format fortunately/unfortunately makes house rules unworkable. If I were asking for my own campaign, I would welcome the suggestions. Because I am asking in part because of Living Greyhawk, I am asking that house rules have no place here, although I will keep them in mind for home campaigns.

 

[strongbow]

(Bump) End of the year is soon, just wanted any more input because my spell access runs out December 31st. See above post for meaning.

 

[dcollins]

Perhaps you should specify exactly what you're trying to accomplish in your Living Greyhawk campaign. Are you really wishing to have your cleric use:

(1) A spell from some non-core rulebook?
(2) A domain spell from a domain he doesn't possess?
(3) A new spell that he's going to research?

Without being an LG player, I would speculate that:

(1) LG doesn't allow any spells from non-core sources.
(2) No one can ever access a domain they don't possess.
(3) LG would have very specific guidelines for "new spells", possibly prohibiting them entirely.
(Or else only granting them as very rare allowances, in writing, from the central directors).

I would highly doubt that any language about "divine writings" in the PH will allow you to expand your cleric's spell list in any way for a Living Greyhawk campaign.

 

[strongbow]

I'm asking these questions for a number of reasons, the least of which is the Living Greyhawk campaign I play in. I'm a DM and a player in two different home campaigns, and need to know as one of my players is asking for more spell access. Of course a DM can Rule 0 anything, and should a lot of times, but I need to know what are the base, technical rules first.

(1) Yes.
(2) I've seen weirder things in D&D, I want the base answer
(3) The rules for primary independent research are clear. The rules for sharing that spell research with others are not.

To answer your second set of observations:

(1) LG does allow spells from non-core sources
(2) I've seen modules where clerics, in three minutes:
(A) Run to an inn over 10 blocks away
(B) Gather all equipment in room
(C) Put on Full Plate Armor by themselves
(D) Cast a few Spells
(E) Change Deities
(F) Memorize new domain spells
(G) Run back to confront the PCs
Anything is possible, including bad module writing.
(3) LG has rules for getting access to new spells, but since the rules for divine casters adding spells to their list are vague (to me) I'm asking questions here.

I'm going to be out of town for 3 or 4 days, I'll check this thread later.

 

[Destil]

A handy house rule many people here use is that a divine caster needs to trade out an existing PHB spell in order to learn a new one, and that new spell must be approved by the DM as a general [their class] spell of the same level. Works for me, at least. The core rules are lacking in that area, IHMO.

 

[Jondor_Battlehammer]

Much the same way gaining higher levels proves your worth to gain more powerful spell, so you might prove your worth to find new spells by spending time and money in "Prayer". As opposed to Arcane research, the Cleric beseaches his god to grant him an unusual power buy spending the equivelent resources as an Arcane caster. The DM then decides if he succeds or fails, just like he does with an Arcane caster. This new spell is exclusive to him, though he could place it on a scroll. That scroll could then be researched by another cleric at a reduced cost, say the same price as placing a new spell into an Arcane spell book. The Dm still has the final say if he has constant acess to that spell.

I would not alter Domain spells in any way, as those are a direct reflection of the deity's personality. Any spell not normally on the Cleric list, including other divine spells such as Magic Fang, I would allow to be researched in the above fashion.

Thus an answer with no rules change, and minimal headache. As far as the slippery slope, it's no more dangerous than allowing a Wizard to research Cure Light Wounds. Allow it or not at your peril.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Spell's not on the cleric's list aren't on the cleric's list. Even if it's another divine spell, he would not get it (exceptions could be made if it's a game where they have no clerics, and therefore omitted the cleric class in the class/levels line, but even that not often, as those spells probably won't fit into the world the cleric is in or the class itself).
AFAIK we're discussing spells on the cleric list, but not in the core rules, and how to get access to them.