D&D 5E D&D and who it's aimed at

[EzekielRaiden]

Erm they've been pushing that since 5E released. Mearls on art eg sexualization etc very early in 5E ,(or even before?).

Don't think we're gonna see an implied orgy or a demon run orphanage in 5E.

And the whole Drow thing.

....if "not having implied orgies" is "Disneyfying" things, then the word means extremely little, wouldn't you say?

Like for real you have taken "Disneyfying" things and turned it into a throwaway term. By that standard, the original Brothers Grimm is "Disneyfied" because orgies are pretty rare! And I have been schooled on "the Drow thing." Several people have noted that "Drow aren't all evil, aren't all dominatrices, etc." started back in 2nd edition apparently!

And I dunno about you, but the sinister implications with Wild Beyond the Witchlight sound not that far off from "a demon run orphanage."

And it's a fact 2E-4E had more mechanical options.

So...let me get this straight. "Disneyfied" means "offers lots of mechanical options and doesn't feature implied orgies."

That's what people are saying. They aren't talking about bright colors, or unrealistic nonviolent positivity, or art style. They're talking about a lack of implied casual sex and fewer mechanical options.

Yeah. Right. Pull the other one.

Those things are objectively true...and also have diddly-squat to do with being "objectively Disneyfied."

 

[Malmuria]

Erm they've been pushing that since 5E released. Mearls on art eg sexualization etc very early in 5E ,(or even before?).

Don't think we're gonna see an implied orgy or a demon run orphanage in 5E.

And the whole Drow thing.

But those changes aren’t there to appeal to children, but rather to make sure women and people of color are comfortable playing the game.

 

[Zardnaar]

But those changes aren’t there to appeal to children, but rather to make sure women and people of color are comfortable playing the game.

Not denying it but it is change.

If someone says the game has been Disneyfied do you know what they mean? I'm not claiming the terms a nice term or who's right or wrong.

I don't use the term myself.

 

[dave2008]

Not denying it but it is change.

If someone says the game has been Disneyfied do you know what they mean? I'm not claiming the terms a nice term or who's right or wrong.

I don't use the term myself.

I have an idea of what it means, but I don't feel it applies to the current state of D&D.

 

[Jahydin]

There is just so little that inspires me anymore.

D&D is the safest, softest, and most corporate it has ever been.

 

[Zardnaar]

I have an idea of what it means, but I don't feel it applies to the current state of D&D.

That's a ymmv last books I bought was Witchlifht, Fizbans and another one. None were overly interesting.

Think I'm gonna stop buy most adventures. Not actually running them and they're not that great.

I'll grab that monster book and Spelljammer when they land and wait and see.

 

[Hussar]

Erm they've been pushing that since 5E released. Mearls on art eg sexualization etc very early in 5E ,(or even before?).

Don't think we're gonna see an implied orgy or a demon run orphanage in 5E.

And the whole Drow thing.

And it's a fact 2E-4E had more mechanical options. All I'm saying is I understand what they mean if they're claiming the games been Disneyfied.

It's basically an insult but it's not without foundation.

See, again, @Zardnaar, I'm really not sure what you're on about. Going back to Candlekeep, because that's the adventure I know:

Book of the Raven - implied child abuse/murder results in portal to the Shadowfell
Deep and Creeping Darkness - evil tortures and murders everyone in the village, and the adventurers are hired by the few broken survivors in the vague hopes of being able to return
Shemshime - a spirit drives everyone mad, causing them to murder everyone around them, and spreads virus like to anyone who hears the song
Price of Beauty - Hags strike Faustian bargains with people, only to betray them and keep them alive to torture them to death.
Book of Cylinders - in one scene, Yuan-ti devour children in front of their parents and laugh about it.
Sarah of Yellowcrest Manor - an entire family plus servants are murdered to power a ritual to bring back some evil from beyond.

I mean, sure, there's no orgy there, but, that's all pretty damn dark. To the point where one of my players complained that the module would be better set in Ravenloft than Candlekeep.

Now, I haven't read the newer books. But, it's not like Candlekeep is an old book. It did come out just a hair over a year ago.

I'd say that the term is pretty much without foundation.

 

[Zardnaar]

See, again, @Zardnaar, I'm really not sure what you're on about. Going back to Candlekeep, because that's the adventure I know:

Book of the Raven - implied child abuse/murder results in portal to the Shadowfell
Deep and Creeping Darkness - evil tortures and murders everyone in the village, and the adventurers are hired by the few broken survivors in the vague hopes of being able to return
Shemshime - a spirit drives everyone mad, causing them to murder everyone around them, and spreads virus like to anyone who hears the song
Price of Beauty - Hags strike Faustian bargains with people, only to betray them and keep them alive to torture them to death.
Book of Cylinders - in one scene, Yuan-ti devour children in front of their parents and laugh about it.
Sarah of Yellowcrest Manor - an entire family plus servants are murdered to power a ritual to bring back some evil from beyond.

I mean, sure, there's no orgy there, but, that's all pretty damn dark. To the point where one of my players complained that the module would be better set in Ravenloft than Candlekeep.

Now, I haven't read the newer books. But, it's not like Candlekeep is an old book. It did come out just a hair over a year ago.

I'd say that the term is pretty much without foundation.

That's in one book though it was right through 3E though starting with the core set.

I wasn't a fan of the 3E ascetic but it was the edgelord edition relative to the others. That or 1E.

I own Candlekeep barely read it but I can say that for most of my recent purchases. Covid and I've been struggling with the 5E books (care factor low).

 

[JEB]

Spelljammer, Ravenloft and Dragonlance are nostalgic attempts to please the old guard.

Ravenloft was a reboot that significantly overhauled the setting, to the point that it actively turned off some veteran fans. I'm sure they hoped old-guard fans would buy it and like it anyway - and some certainly did - but their primary focus there was clearly on newer players, not older ones.

Whether Spelljammer and Dragonlance follow the same path remains to be seen.

 

[JEB]

No, I have a problem with the marketing, and choices like removal of Alignment, and ASI defaults.

To be fair, they did restore alignment. Which indicates they're still paying attention to a diverse array of fans; I have no doubt that it would have stayed gone had they felt there was overwhelming support for it.

(However, I'm pretty confident ASI defaults are gone for good. Maybe they'll include suggested "classic" ASI placements in the 2024 rules, though.)