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<blockquote data-quote="Fox Lee" data-source="post: 8374224" data-attributes="member: 4346"><p>This is the same complaint used by every person who gets salty when you ask them to stop using slurs or making gay jokes, so it may not be the winning zinger you think it is. Some restrictions are good.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Amateurs are definitely not like scabs. However, a <em>business</em> offering spec work to amateurs in lieu of hiring professionals <em>is</em> like a business hiring scabs to avoid paying workers. The comparison is not between the individuals getting the work, it is between the actions of the businesses making the profit.</p><p></p><p>That's why nobody was on Twitter slamming artists who participate in these competitions; rather, we let the company know that we recognise spec work as exploitative. That's also why "campaigning for people not to enter" is not a useful idea; the individuals do not have the power in these scenarios. It would be like blaming a DoorDash driver for taking work from a garbage company that undermines minimum wage law and exploits poverty—the worker is not the problem. The power lies with the company, the faulty practice lies with the company, so that's who we criticise.</p><p></p><p></p><p>It <em>is</em> spec work though (<em>on spec</em> obviously; I don't know how anything I've said could be misinterpreted to the point that you need to post a massive wall of splaining at me). I disagree that anything you have said shows how this is materially different from spec work; that's not a valid point to argue here AFAIC.</p><p></p><p>It's clear in how you've listed my "credentials" that you don't consider my connection to DNDB valid, but that's not for you to decide. I've already made it clear why this community is important to me as a professional and as a fan. But even if I didn't, spec work from any well-funded company helps devalue the entire industry one tiny bit at a time, so we have a stake in this whether you like it or not.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm happy that DNDB listened to public opinion and decided that there are better ways to garner public goodwill than to use a fundamentally exploitative business practice, yes. Because that's all this is; a business tried to drum up some publicity with an art/design contest, copped some flak because said contest was recognised by artists/designers as dodgy, and ultimately pulled the plug because they judged the bad publicity to outweigh the good.</p><p></p><p>You seem to be under the impression that I care whether DNDB thinks they were actually wrong, or were "pressured" into withdrawing the competition, but as far as I'm concerned that's a nonsensical question. Businesses* are<em> by design</em> amoral money machines concerned with what's profitable, not with inherent values of "good" or "bad". Being "pressured"—whether by law, market forces, public opinion etc.—is the <em>only</em> reason they ever appear to act in anything that resembles moral fashion.</p><p></p><p>(*Save the <em>very</em> smallest businesses which can genuinely be spoken for, and answer to, maybe one or two people)</p><p></p><p>So, while it would be just <em>swell</em> if some individuals involved had a personal epiphany about why spec work is garbo, I'll settle for convincing the business that it would not be profitable to do the bad thing, just this once, even though we obviously know they're only covering their bottom (line). That—and the possibility that more community members (even non-professionals) will recognise and call out dodgy practices like spec work—is the best we can realistically hope for.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Fox Lee, post: 8374224, member: 4346"] This is the same complaint used by every person who gets salty when you ask them to stop using slurs or making gay jokes, so it may not be the winning zinger you think it is. Some restrictions are good. Amateurs are definitely not like scabs. However, a [I]business[/I] offering spec work to amateurs in lieu of hiring professionals [I]is[/I] like a business hiring scabs to avoid paying workers. The comparison is not between the individuals getting the work, it is between the actions of the businesses making the profit. That's why nobody was on Twitter slamming artists who participate in these competitions; rather, we let the company know that we recognise spec work as exploitative. That's also why "campaigning for people not to enter" is not a useful idea; the individuals do not have the power in these scenarios. It would be like blaming a DoorDash driver for taking work from a garbage company that undermines minimum wage law and exploits poverty—the worker is not the problem. The power lies with the company, the faulty practice lies with the company, so that's who we criticise. It [I]is[/I] spec work though ([I]on spec[/I] obviously; I don't know how anything I've said could be misinterpreted to the point that you need to post a massive wall of splaining at me). I disagree that anything you have said shows how this is materially different from spec work; that's not a valid point to argue here AFAIC. It's clear in how you've listed my "credentials" that you don't consider my connection to DNDB valid, but that's not for you to decide. I've already made it clear why this community is important to me as a professional and as a fan. But even if I didn't, spec work from any well-funded company helps devalue the entire industry one tiny bit at a time, so we have a stake in this whether you like it or not. I'm happy that DNDB listened to public opinion and decided that there are better ways to garner public goodwill than to use a fundamentally exploitative business practice, yes. Because that's all this is; a business tried to drum up some publicity with an art/design contest, copped some flak because said contest was recognised by artists/designers as dodgy, and ultimately pulled the plug because they judged the bad publicity to outweigh the good. You seem to be under the impression that I care whether DNDB thinks they were actually wrong, or were "pressured" into withdrawing the competition, but as far as I'm concerned that's a nonsensical question. Businesses* are[I] by design[/I] amoral money machines concerned with what's profitable, not with inherent values of "good" or "bad". Being "pressured"—whether by law, market forces, public opinion etc.—is the [I]only[/I] reason they ever appear to act in anything that resembles moral fashion. (*Save the [I]very[/I] smallest businesses which can genuinely be spoken for, and answer to, maybe one or two people) So, while it would be just [I]swell[/I] if some individuals involved had a personal epiphany about why spec work is garbo, I'll settle for convincing the business that it would not be profitable to do the bad thing, just this once, even though we obviously know they're only covering their bottom (line). That—and the possibility that more community members (even non-professionals) will recognise and call out dodgy practices like spec work—is the best we can realistically hope for. [/QUOTE]
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