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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 5939367" data-attributes="member: 48965">I've noticed that often, though not always, the stories of TPK's tend to have one of two things in common... A.) The players are just starting 4e and thus it can be attributed more to unfmiliarity with the game, their characters, the other player's characters, etc, or... B.) It's that the encounter basically breaks the given guidelines.  As an example the Iroontooth encounter from KoS is often cited... but a hard encounter is defined as 2-4 levels above your PC's and Iroontooth was 5 levels above the PC's, and even then many parties defeated the encounter without a TPK.  On a side note, it makes me wonder if the guidelines for 4e encounter building are actually as good as people claim or do they just minimize party death and thus get less slack for being inaccurate than CR and EL.</blockquote>