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<blockquote data-quote="jmartkdr2" data-source="post: 9043281" data-attributes="member: 7017304"><p>Honestly I think policing metagaming has done an order of magnitude more damage to my gaming experience than actual metagaming. </p><p></p><p>Especially with trolls. Trolls are just badly-designed monsters since nothing about them clues you in to what will stop the regeneration. It's not even part of the mythology of trolls outside of dnd. So the only ways to know are metagaming of various sorts:</p><p></p><p>1. You know dnd tropes so you know, but the character may or may not. You choose to metagame and cast <em>fire bolt </em>instead of another cantrip.</p><p></p><p>2. The pc rolls a knowledge check, which has all the normal pitfalls of gating important, let-the-game-proceed knowledge behind checks. Basically you've added an undynamic extra step to the combat. </p><p></p><p>3. You know, but don't want to metagame, so you play a weird sort of meta-meta-game where you try to figure out how many wrong guesses are enough to be "realistic" </p><p></p><p>4. You want to do #3 but the only attack cantrip you know is <em>fire bolt </em>so of course you'd use that but the dm accuses you of metagaming so you derail the game with an argument about whether your character would lead with their most obvious option despite the fact that it ruins the 'surprise'...</p><p></p><p>Not for nothing, most of important weaknesses in other monsters are either telegraphed or expected to be so obscure and specific that you need to research it in-game anyways. Trolls are uniquely bad as far as I know. Fire elementals being immune to fire isn't hidden information. Undead needing radiant to kill is assumed to be something anyone in that setting would try. Rakshasa aren't supposed to be known by anyone not an expert on rakshasa, but that's built into their design - you don't need a silver arrow to drive it off, just to make sure it doesn't come after you once it recovers. Even vampires are protected form the stupid meta-meta-game of trolls by the fact that players have likely heard of a dozen weaknesses that may or may not apply, so they probably are genuinely guessing (plus it's reasonable for the vampire to specifically protect themselves, and for folklore or old books to have the info.)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="jmartkdr2, post: 9043281, member: 7017304"] Honestly I think policing metagaming has done an order of magnitude more damage to my gaming experience than actual metagaming. Especially with trolls. Trolls are just badly-designed monsters since nothing about them clues you in to what will stop the regeneration. It's not even part of the mythology of trolls outside of dnd. So the only ways to know are metagaming of various sorts: 1. You know dnd tropes so you know, but the character may or may not. You choose to metagame and cast [I]fire bolt [/I]instead of another cantrip. 2. The pc rolls a knowledge check, which has all the normal pitfalls of gating important, let-the-game-proceed knowledge behind checks. Basically you've added an undynamic extra step to the combat. 3. You know, but don't want to metagame, so you play a weird sort of meta-meta-game where you try to figure out how many wrong guesses are enough to be "realistic" 4. You want to do #3 but the only attack cantrip you know is [I]fire bolt [/I]so of course you'd use that but the dm accuses you of metagaming so you derail the game with an argument about whether your character would lead with their most obvious option despite the fact that it ruins the 'surprise'... Not for nothing, most of important weaknesses in other monsters are either telegraphed or expected to be so obscure and specific that you need to research it in-game anyways. Trolls are uniquely bad as far as I know. Fire elementals being immune to fire isn't hidden information. Undead needing radiant to kill is assumed to be something anyone in that setting would try. Rakshasa aren't supposed to be known by anyone not an expert on rakshasa, but that's built into their design - you don't need a silver arrow to drive it off, just to make sure it doesn't come after you once it recovers. Even vampires are protected form the stupid meta-meta-game of trolls by the fact that players have likely heard of a dozen weaknesses that may or may not apply, so they probably are genuinely guessing (plus it's reasonable for the vampire to specifically protect themselves, and for folklore or old books to have the info.) [/QUOTE]
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