Mal Malenkirk
First Post
Mustrum_Ridcully said:
Obviously because I don't like it.
I could rant for hours about the 18D6 dice pool and the statistical blind spot created by the 6-7 equality but that is neither the time or the place.
D20 Shadowrun Gets a whole lot easier
- Thread starter Sidran
- Start date
Obviously because I don't like it.
I could rant for hours about the 18D6 dice pool and the statistical blind spot created by the 6-7 equality but that is neither the time or the place.
Cergorach
The Laughing One
Mal Malenkirk said:
If the statistical blindspot would be the biggest problem i would be estatic! The scarry big buckets of dice to resolve combat is what IMHO is 'wrong' with SR (in any of it's three incarnations).
'wrong' is in this case difened as not liked by my group, and it seems by many rpg groups if the net is any indication.
I'm currently working on a rules set that is ideal for a cyberpunk/fantasy setting, th idea is to make the whole rules set OGL, so that it can be published without legal repercusions...
Priest
First Post
By the way Tensen, for my purposes in working on the Shadowrun conversion (and as a quick fix for my new players) I bought the Cyber Style from RPG now, thank you for the singular read. (though I had some problems with some of the layout)
And if you are still interested I would be willing to send the little I have of the D20 Detectives stuff to you for whatever you want to do with it, after a try at getting it going I have just plain given up.
And if you are still interested I would be willing to send the little I have of the D20 Detectives stuff to you for whatever you want to do with it, after a try at getting it going I have just plain given up.
Priest
First Post
Personally I plan on keeping things such as BAB, and the saves
I see the Hit Points (and how much a person can take) as a question of
SW Wound system, D&D 3e HP system, or M&M Damage System or the Original Vitality chart from SR
In the matter over Class Vrs. Classless I personally feal that Class works better with the D20 System. Though writing those classes would be a chore of imaginative granduer. It would have to be a give and take, literally what would a Street Samurai get as Class abilities (and even this is questioned should a SS be a PrC or a CC)
Some things however are easy
All Characters should get at Character Creation 3 Contacts (from a list much the same as the one in the SR 2nd Edition HB)
A Decker is still a guy who is good at hacking an IC
A Rigger is still a woman who grew up liking Remote Control Toys
and an Orc Mercenary still likes things that go BOOM...
There are some things that I would not even try to handle I.E. Magic system.
The Cyber Style system treats there Net Runner class as a variant type of magic almost with APPS replacing spells.
Perhaps that is the beginning of the answer for the matrix.
I see the Hit Points (and how much a person can take) as a question of
SW Wound system, D&D 3e HP system, or M&M Damage System or the Original Vitality chart from SR
In the matter over Class Vrs. Classless I personally feal that Class works better with the D20 System. Though writing those classes would be a chore of imaginative granduer. It would have to be a give and take, literally what would a Street Samurai get as Class abilities (and even this is questioned should a SS be a PrC or a CC)
Some things however are easy
All Characters should get at Character Creation 3 Contacts (from a list much the same as the one in the SR 2nd Edition HB)
A Decker is still a guy who is good at hacking an IC
A Rigger is still a woman who grew up liking Remote Control Toys
and an Orc Mercenary still likes things that go BOOM...
There are some things that I would not even try to handle I.E. Magic system.
The Cyber Style system treats there Net Runner class as a variant type of magic almost with APPS replacing spells.
Perhaps that is the beginning of the answer for the matrix.
Priest
First Post
I am going to start tearing away at this compilation site
HERE
First Off RACES
Human: Same as Player's Handbook
Fine as is
Dwarf: +1 STR, -1 DEX, +2 CON, -2 CHR. No Stonecunning, no racial bonus to attack orcs & goblins, no dodge bonus against giants, retains bonus to Appraise and Craft. Favored Class: Tech.
I have a problem with not replacing the Stonecunning with something to do with mechanical stuff.
And favored class should be Rigger
Elf: -1 STR, +2 DEX, -2 CON, +2 CHR. No automatic prof. with Swords and Bows. All other special abilities the same. Favored Class: Wizard.
No Prob here cept again I feel that what is taken away should have something to fill it perhaps a single weapon proficiency feat (player's choice)
And FC should be Decker, or Mage
Orc: Same as half-orc in Player's Handbook. Favored Class: Street Samurai.
NP cept the FC should be FC Mercenary, or Street Samurai
Troll: +4 STR, +2 CON, -2 DEX, -3 INT, -3 CHR. Large Creature (-1 AC, -1 Att. Bonus, 10ft Reach), Natural Armor +4, Bonus Feat: Toughness. Favored Class: Ganger.
Reduce the NA to +2
FC Mercenary, or Street Samurai
Remove bonus feat toughness
HERE
First Off RACES
Human: Same as Player's Handbook
Fine as is
Dwarf: +1 STR, -1 DEX, +2 CON, -2 CHR. No Stonecunning, no racial bonus to attack orcs & goblins, no dodge bonus against giants, retains bonus to Appraise and Craft. Favored Class: Tech.
I have a problem with not replacing the Stonecunning with something to do with mechanical stuff.
And favored class should be Rigger
Elf: -1 STR, +2 DEX, -2 CON, +2 CHR. No automatic prof. with Swords and Bows. All other special abilities the same. Favored Class: Wizard.
No Prob here cept again I feel that what is taken away should have something to fill it perhaps a single weapon proficiency feat (player's choice)
And FC should be Decker, or Mage
Orc: Same as half-orc in Player's Handbook. Favored Class: Street Samurai.
NP cept the FC should be FC Mercenary, or Street Samurai
Troll: +4 STR, +2 CON, -2 DEX, -3 INT, -3 CHR. Large Creature (-1 AC, -1 Att. Bonus, 10ft Reach), Natural Armor +4, Bonus Feat: Toughness. Favored Class: Ganger.
Reduce the NA to +2
FC Mercenary, or Street Samurai
Remove bonus feat toughness
Last edited:
Priest
First Post
ABOUT THE ABOVE POST
I Think that the races should be more balanced (as far as ability mods) And all characters should start with an Essence of 6.0 or something similar.
Classes
I know the opinions of everyone who has posted here, so with that in mind the Classes should be as followed (this is a short hand class work up)(IF indeed HD is used as the Damage system)
Decker-
HD d6
BAB as Cleric
Good Saves Fort, and Will Poor Saves Ref
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +1 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +2 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +3 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+4 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +5 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +6 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills: (Like the Rogues, but for the SR world)
Skill Points for 1st Level (8+Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 8+ Int Modifer
Starts with Deck (still to be rules designed) The deck type depends on his Lifestyle choice, and his starting tech.
Abilities should have things to do with Running in the matrix, and Decking in General.
Rigger-
HD d4
BAB, as Wizard
Good Saves Ref, and Will Poor Saves Fort
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +1 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +2 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +3 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+4 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +5 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +6 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills ( Bard Like Skill List)
Skill Points for 1st Level (4 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 4 + Int Modifer
Class Abilities:
Abilities that will help to operate ROV's, whether they are Drones, or Robots, or Rigged Vehicles.
Mercenary-
HD d10
BAB, as Fighter
Good Saves Fort Bad Saves Ref and Will
Rep [1] +0 [2] +1 [3] +1 [4] +2 [5] +2 [6] +3 [7] +3 [8] +4 [9] +4 [10] +5 [11] +5 [12]+6 [13]+6 [14]+7 [15] +7 [16] +8 [17] +8 [18] +9 [19] +9 [20]+10
Class Skills (As fighter list)
Skill Points for 1st Level (2 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 2 + Int Modifer
Class Abilities: Mostly the same as a Fighter from the PHB
Perhaps at 1st level the Merc gets 1 more contact than normal
or his abilities go like so.
1. Contact, 2. Bonus Feat 3.----4. Contact, 5. Bonus Feat ...
Street Samurai
HD d10
BAB as Monk
Good Saves: Fort, Ref Bad Will
Rep [1] +1 [2] +1 [3] +2 [4] +2 [5] +3 [6] +3 [7] +4 [8] +4 [9] +5 [10] +5 [11] +6 [12]+6 [13]+7 [14]+7 [15] +8 [16] +8 [17] +9 [18] +9 [19] +10 [20]+10
Class Skills (As fighter list with a few extra's)
Skill Points for 1st Level (4 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 4 + Int Modifer
Abilities
Starts with +2 Cybernetic Implants (From the Starting Cyberware SS List) The Contact progression of the Merc, and a few enhancement abilities ( Like Enhance Scent, or Enhance Vision) or what have you.
Full Mage (Wizard Style)
HD d4
BAB: As Cleric
Good Saves Fort, & Will Poor Saves Ref
Rep [1] +0 [2] +1 [3] +1 [4] +2 [5] +2 [6] +3 [7] +3 [8] +4 [9] +4 [10] +5 [11] +5 [12]+6 [13]+6 [14]+7 [15] +7 [16] +8 [17] +8 [18] +9 [19] +9 [20]+10
Class Skills (As a Wizard)
Skill Points for 1st Level (6 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 6 + Int Modifer
Street Mage (Sorcerer Style)
HD d6
BAB: As Rogue
Good Saves Ref, & Will Poor Saves Fort
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +1 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +2 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +3 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+4 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +5 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +6 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills (As a Wizard)
Skill Points for 1st Level (4 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 4 + Int Modifer
Burned Out Mage (Adept Style)
HD d8
BAB as Fighter
Good Saves Will Poor Saves Fort, & Ref
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +0 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +1 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +2 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+3 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +4 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +5 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills (As a Fighter with a few extra's)
Skill Points for 1st Level (2 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 2 + Int Modifer
Limited Spells: Has a limited selection of Arcane Spells
Starts with Cyberware (as Street Sam)
Any I Miss? Let me know.
I Think that the races should be more balanced (as far as ability mods) And all characters should start with an Essence of 6.0 or something similar.
Classes
I know the opinions of everyone who has posted here, so with that in mind the Classes should be as followed (this is a short hand class work up)(IF indeed HD is used as the Damage system)
Decker-
HD d6
BAB as Cleric
Good Saves Fort, and Will Poor Saves Ref
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +1 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +2 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +3 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+4 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +5 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +6 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills: (Like the Rogues, but for the SR world)
Skill Points for 1st Level (8+Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 8+ Int Modifer
Starts with Deck (still to be rules designed) The deck type depends on his Lifestyle choice, and his starting tech.
Abilities should have things to do with Running in the matrix, and Decking in General.
Rigger-
HD d4
BAB, as Wizard
Good Saves Ref, and Will Poor Saves Fort
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +1 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +2 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +3 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+4 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +5 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +6 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills ( Bard Like Skill List)
Skill Points for 1st Level (4 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 4 + Int Modifer
Class Abilities:
Abilities that will help to operate ROV's, whether they are Drones, or Robots, or Rigged Vehicles.
Mercenary-
HD d10
BAB, as Fighter
Good Saves Fort Bad Saves Ref and Will
Rep [1] +0 [2] +1 [3] +1 [4] +2 [5] +2 [6] +3 [7] +3 [8] +4 [9] +4 [10] +5 [11] +5 [12]+6 [13]+6 [14]+7 [15] +7 [16] +8 [17] +8 [18] +9 [19] +9 [20]+10
Class Skills (As fighter list)
Skill Points for 1st Level (2 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 2 + Int Modifer
Class Abilities: Mostly the same as a Fighter from the PHB
Perhaps at 1st level the Merc gets 1 more contact than normal
or his abilities go like so.
1. Contact, 2. Bonus Feat 3.----4. Contact, 5. Bonus Feat ...
Street Samurai
HD d10
BAB as Monk
Good Saves: Fort, Ref Bad Will
Rep [1] +1 [2] +1 [3] +2 [4] +2 [5] +3 [6] +3 [7] +4 [8] +4 [9] +5 [10] +5 [11] +6 [12]+6 [13]+7 [14]+7 [15] +8 [16] +8 [17] +9 [18] +9 [19] +10 [20]+10
Class Skills (As fighter list with a few extra's)
Skill Points for 1st Level (4 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 4 + Int Modifer
Abilities
Starts with +2 Cybernetic Implants (From the Starting Cyberware SS List) The Contact progression of the Merc, and a few enhancement abilities ( Like Enhance Scent, or Enhance Vision) or what have you.
Full Mage (Wizard Style)
HD d4
BAB: As Cleric
Good Saves Fort, & Will Poor Saves Ref
Rep [1] +0 [2] +1 [3] +1 [4] +2 [5] +2 [6] +3 [7] +3 [8] +4 [9] +4 [10] +5 [11] +5 [12]+6 [13]+6 [14]+7 [15] +7 [16] +8 [17] +8 [18] +9 [19] +9 [20]+10
Class Skills (As a Wizard)
Skill Points for 1st Level (6 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 6 + Int Modifer
Street Mage (Sorcerer Style)
HD d6
BAB: As Rogue
Good Saves Ref, & Will Poor Saves Fort
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +1 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +2 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +3 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+4 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +5 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +6 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills (As a Wizard)
Skill Points for 1st Level (4 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 4 + Int Modifer
Burned Out Mage (Adept Style)
HD d8
BAB as Fighter
Good Saves Will Poor Saves Fort, & Ref
Rep [1] +0 [2] +0 [3] +0 [4] +1 [5] +1 [6] +1 [7] +2 [8] +2 [9] +2 [10] +3 [11] +3 [12]+3 [13]+4 [14]+4 [15] +4 [16] +5 [17] +5 [18] +5 [19] +6 [20]+6
Class Skills (As a Fighter with a few extra's)
Skill Points for 1st Level (2 + Int Modifier) x 4
Skill Points for each level after first 2 + Int Modifer
Limited Spells: Has a limited selection of Arcane Spells
Starts with Cyberware (as Street Sam)
Any I Miss? Let me know.
Mustrum_Ridcully
Legend
The bucket of Dice and the 6-7 Blind Spot aren`t really a problem...
A problem are thousand other often unbalanced, stupid and not working rules they seem to invent in every incarnation and every additional rule/sourcebook.
Mustrum Ridcully
A problem are thousand other often unbalanced, stupid and not working rules they seem to invent in every incarnation and every additional rule/sourcebook.
Mustrum Ridcully
Baron Von StarBlade
Registered User
Priest said:
I would consider changing the int/chr penalty to either -2 or -4. Odd stat bonus/penalty make it easier to min/max stats.
Similar Threads
