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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mind of tempest" data-source="post: 8711520" data-attributes="member: 7029233">welcome to the problems of interpersonal relationshipsor we could just do it properly and not force everything into a class it does not belong to.true but that depends on doing it properly and sufficiently different to work, see the sorcerer for how it can fail.a) it is not.b) just because you can brut force a thing to do what you want does not mean a proper thing should not be built.okay, describe a cleric without a god how do they gain power? and why do they get the power that way?okay you're happy, why does that mean I should go without the thing I want?why do we need any class in dnd why not just have fighting man and wizard?do you want to make a MAD as hell multi-class to play what you want or do you just want to play it in one class?this is true but only because games design was bad in those days and the fact they literally copied the badly working stuff in for insane reasons, not that the idea was bad itself.</blockquote>