D&D 4E Default setting for 4E?

[Nightfall]

Mishra only wishes he could do stuff like Hephestus(sp).

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Yeah...he probably works best as a demigod or some such, but you get the point!

 

[Kae'Yoss]

A product I'd like to see, but know I never will, would be a collection of the deities and epic level PCs of the Magic: The Gathering World...

Yeah, really weird, that. The M:TG guys are whining around about "diluting the brand" or something. I still think A Magic: The Gathering d20 game could bring a lot of card players over to D&D

But it would be interesting to intersperse a few of them into a 4th Ed setting, to replace those that are too closely linked to the RW and there is no question about how familiar a lot of younger gamers would be with those names.

No, I don't want that. Magic material should be optional.

 

[qstor]

Should - Greyhawk

Will be the default - Eberron

Mike

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Will be the default - Eberron

No way in all the lower planes. They they would destroy D&D should they use Eberron as default setting - not only will the concept of Campaign Settings suffer greatly, they'll also lose a lot of customers who do strongly object to anything Eberron. And they know it. They will keep something inoffensive as default, while providing campaign settings for the other stuff.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Dannyalcatraz
A product I'd like to see, but know I never will, would be a collection of the deities and epic level PCs of the Magic: The Gathering World...

Kae'Yoss
Yeah, really weird, that. The M:TG guys are whining around about "diluting the brand" or something. I still think A Magic: The Gathering d20 game could bring a lot of card players over to D&D

I don't know that it could be fully developed- so much of that game would be (in D&D terms) epic...it lends itself better to something like Primal Order...or Everway...or even the non-WotC product Exalted.

Dannyalcatraz
But it would be interesting to intersperse a few of them into a 4th Ed setting, to replace those that are too closely linked to the RW and there is no question about how familiar a lot of younger gamers would be with those names.

Kae'Yoss
No, I don't want that. Magic material should be optional.

But it could be!

Just like 3.X, I don't forsee them making Philosophies dissapear from the Clerics...and if they try to appease a broad base of D&D gamers, those M:tG deities and demigods would be presented as options or exemplars of "X" kind of divine figure.

Example: They could have a section on deities that include writeups for Greater, Lesser, Minor, Demi- gods, and Philosophies of the Forge. Then they could simply associate names with each level, much like the list of typical Elf names under the racial description for Elves.

So, alongside Greater gods of the forge, they would name Moradin. Under Minor or Demi, they could list Mishra...but the names would just be exemplars- you could name them whatever you want.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

No way in all the lower planes. They they would destroy D&D should they use Eberron as default setting - not only will the concept of Campaign Settings suffer greatly, they'll also lose a lot of customers who do strongly object to anything Eberron.

While I agree that Eberron won't be the default setting - because it goes far beyond the classical "D&D archetypes" - I assume that the people who strongly object to anything Eberron are ultimately only a small minority.

I mean, there are plenty of people out there who strongly object to anything D&D, and yet D&D still remains the biggest RPG out there...

 

[Kae'Yoss]

I don't know that it could be fully developed- so much of that game would be (in D&D terms) epic...it lends itself better to something like Primal Order...or Everway...or even the non-WotC product Exalted.

The epic part does not mean that it cannot be done in d20. A campaign setting that focuses on epic play might be fun.

Besides, it doesn't have to have epic player characters. They could start low and work their way up. I don't know about Magic's premise and back story, but I think there are some individuals there that started small.

I guess in Magic the card game, you are some great warlord or something to fight others of your ilk? The RPG doesn't have to put you into such a prestigious position - not at first.

You could sell it as playing Great Magic Warlords (or whatever it is you're supposed to be in the card game) in the making (you could always suggest the alternative rule of starting way up as big wigs, especially for more experienced Magic RPG players).


Magic would not be the first CCG that got a roleplaying game afterwards (and there's also lots of card games that came after their respective RPGs): Legend of the Five Rings started as a card game (and still continues), but about 10 years ago, they made an RPG set in the world of Rokugan. IMO, that one's one of the greatest game worlds ever, the game sounds very great, too. It's now in its third edition, and had a phase of d20 books during its own second edition (with the exception of the Campaign setting, all those books were for both the L5R native rules and for d20).

And in the L5R RPG, you don't play a great general or clan champion, either (at least not at first - it's of course always an option for later if the GM should so choose). You usually start as a minor Samurai (the caste, not the character class of katana-wielding warriors, though they're also present, of course) there. In the Card Game, you play a powerful warlord or something, I think.

In fact, the outcomes of the big L5R CCG tournaments determine how the storyline continues. Say, as backdrop for this or that tourney is a grand battle where most of the clans fight against the united forces of the Shadowlands and a minor clan that has been tainted.

If a player representing one of the clans should win, his clan will be the one most responsible for the imperial forces' victory over the tainted beasts. Should a Shadowlands player win, the Empire will have a major setback (and if a tainted clansman wins, his clan will rise to prominence within the shadowlands power structure).

But it could be!
Just like 3.X, I don't forsee them making Philosophies dissapear from the Clerics...and if they try to appease a broad base of D&D gamers, those M:tG deities and demigods would be presented as options or exemplars of "X" kind of divine figure.

The problem is: many roleplayers don't really like card games. And if now the story of one of those card games poaches on their RPG's grounds, they'll probably be petered off big time.

For those, there should be a M:tG-free D&D environment (as there should be a FR-free environment for FR haters and an Eberron-Free game for Eberron haters).

It would be fine as a campaign setting,though - or maybe its own d20 RPG!

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

The epic part does not mean that it cannot be done in d20. A campaign setting that focuses on epic play might be fun.

True, but D20 doesn't exactly lend itself to epic play, IMHO.

Besides, it doesn't have to have epic player characters. They could start low and work their way up. I don't know about Magic's premise and back story, but I think there are some individuals there that started small.

True, to a certain extent...but the magic of M:tG is pretty highly scaled. I mean, there are apocalyptic spells that affect the entire "game world." In fact, a great deal of what gives the game its unique flavor is manipulating beings and forces of great power, which is why I brought up Primal Order or Exalted. Few are the D&D PCs who would summon a Pit Fiend with impunity, or travel time as a matter of course.

If the players don't start off relatively powerful in a M:tG RPG, I don't think it would have the right feel.

I guess in Magic the card game, you are some great warlord or something to fight others of your ilk? The RPG doesn't have to put you into such a prestigious position - not at first.

Technically, the backstory is that a game of magic is a duel between 2 powerful wizards.

The problem is: many roleplayers don't really like card games. And if now the story of one of those card games poaches on their RPG's grounds, they'll probably be petered off big time.

I think you're overstating my position there...I was thinking more along the lines of them statting out generic divine beings of various power levels and responsibilities, and then using the names as exemplars. IOW, a greater storm god would be statted out, and then they'd say something like "Exemplars of this type of deity are Thor, Zeus, & this guy from M:TG"

 

[Kae'Yoss]

If the players don't start off relatively powerful in a M:tG RPG, I don't think it would have the right feel.

Technically, the backstory is that a game of magic is a duel between 2 powerful wizards.

As I said: L5R is, as far as I know, two generals/warlords pitting their forces against each other. I don't know much about the card game, never bothered to learn the rules, but I think there are cards with castles, and whole companies/legions. I think there are several levels in the game - army vs. army, duels between personalities, spell duels, all that.

And the RPG isn't about playing daimyos that compete against each other. Like most other games, each player has a character, and they work together as a party, becoming more powerful as time passes.

the Magic RPG could be like that as well: The same game world as the card game, but the players form a cooperative party of (initially) low-powered, unexperienced heroes who go on quests and become more powerful.

I know that there are Magic novels. Does anyone read them? What are the protagonists like? Surely they're not about two epic wizards fighting each other.

I think you're overstating my position there...I was thinking more along the lines of them statting out generic divine beings of various power levels and responsibilities, and then using the names as exemplars. IOW, a greater storm god would be statted out, and then they'd say something like "Exemplars of this type of deity are Thor, Zeus, & this guy from M:TG"

Ah. Okay then, that is a sound suggestion.