Defenses confirmed!!!!!!

[Reaper Steve]

I really hope that doesn't mean that we'll see SWSE's craptastic skill system ported over into 4e. I am really really unfond of it.

Later
silver

I, on the other hand, am very fond of it.
I'd just make these minor changes:
1)Skill Focus = not a flat +5, but +level instead of +1/2 level (that's already a popular houserule and it might even be an oficial alternative.)
2) Climb, Jump, and Swim all combined into Athletics. Maybe give swim a penalty unless trained...but on the other hand, they're heroic fantasy charcters, lt them swim!
3) Acrobatics: sets the DC for the attack instead of being against a flat DC.

Other than that, I'll take SWSE skills in my DnD!

 

[HeinorNY]

1)Skill Focus = not a flat +5, but +level instead of +1/2 level (that's already a popular houserule and it might even be an oficial alternative.)

I've never tried this house rule, allow me to ask you two things:
-Does it make skills a little/a lot more harder to keep track?

-Does the character start gaining the +level bonus to the skill at the level he becomes trained, or is it retroactive, so a 20 lvl character that becomes trained suddenly gets +10 to that skill modifier?

 

[Klaus]

You guys are missing the REALLY important point:

The "Jesus Saves... And Takes Half Damage" t-shirt will become obsolete.

Damn you, WotC!

 

[Michael Silverbane]

You don't like the lack of skills?

What I don't like is the lack of granularity... There are essentially only three levels of skill-edness. You're bad at it (untrained), good at it (trained) or really good at it (focused) and... that's it.

I am pretty happy to hear that there will be some difference between the SWSE and 4th ed skills. I just hope that they're the right sort of differences.

Later
silver

 

[Reaper Steve]

I've never tried this house rule, allow me to ask you two things:
-Does it make skills a little/a lot more harder to keep track?

-Does the character start gaining the +level bonus to the skill at the level he becomes trained, or is it retroactive, so a 20 lvl character that becomes trained suddenly gets +10 to that skill modifier?

1) Well, you do have to adjust the skill bonus every level...but you have to do that anyway. I don't think it adds any more complexity/bookkeeping to have trained vs. untrained advance differently.

2) Yeah, I guess that could happen, but would be really rare. Is your 20th level char really going to use his feat for a new skill at that point? In return, it un-frontloads a flat bonus. More versimilitude with an accelerated scaled advance versus a lump +5. But that versimilitude does break if a high level char trains in a new skill.

 

[Jer]

What I don't like is the lack of granularity... There are essentially only three levels of skill-edness. You're bad at it (untrained), good at it (trained) or really good at it (focused) and... that's it.

Whereas I'm really happy to see them moving away from the single point-based granularity of 3e - I've never liked clamping a Runequest-style point-based skill system onto a class-based game.

I wouldn't mind seeing a bad/decent/good/really good level of granularity for skills, but anything that gets point-based systems out of my class-based game is fine in my book.

 

[Reaper Steve]

What I don't like is the lack of granularity... There are essentially only three levels of skill-edness. You're bad at it (untrained), good at it (trained) or really good at it (focused) and... that's it.

Plus the +0 to +10 based on level and any ability score bonuses. Across the same level, the granularity is coarse, but across the full spectrum of play, I think it has enough detail.

I would like skills to advance at +1/level instead of +1/2 per level for more detail, but then you'd have to rewicker the DCs.

 

[Thunderfoot]

You guys are missing the REALLY important point:

The "Jesus Saves... And Takes Half Damage" t-shirt will become obsolete.

Damn you, WotC!

Yes, but "Jesus Saves...but Gretzky picks it up in the crease, skates, backhands...SCORES!!!" is still a viable shirt.

 

[Michael Silverbane]

Maybe they could use different progressions (poor, medium, good; like BAB) for each skill (though that might be more complex than folks like) and then make for some means of further customizing, like feats and talents and whatnot. I don't know.

Later
silver

 

[HeinorNY]

Maybe they could use different progressions (poor, medium, good; like BAB) for each skill (though that might be more complex than folks like) and then make for some means of further customizing, like feats and talents and whatnot. I don't know.

Later
silver

Maybe a good progression for class skills, poor for non class skills.
Flat bonuses for trained and focused skills.