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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Design Debate: 13th-level PCs vs. 6- to 8-Encounter Adventuring Day
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<blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 6864244" data-attributes="member: 6787650"><p>Yes to multiclassing and feats. No thanks to optional point buy variant. I'd rather stick to PHB rolled stats. Please roll stats for me in your capacity as DM, or if you'd rather not I will do it myself, but it's better if you do. You can use <a href="http://www.brockjones.com/dieroller/dice.htm" target="_blank">http://www.brockjones.com/dieroller/dice.htm</a> if you want something that is easy to copy/paste.</p><p></p><p><strong>Edit:</strong> It will be better and simpler if my PCs have no magic items. That's my preferred style anyway.</p><p></p><p><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000">I think it will be obvious if you use exploits as cheap as the ones I have in mind, e.g. CR 1/4 monsters that can kill entire 10th level parties by exploiting the DMG's monster-construction rules*. As long as you stick to stuff that you would actually consider using in a real adventure we should be fine. If you do something silly like give all the monsters truesight and letting them ignore PC stealth and just pop out of the hidden rooms exactly when the PCs happen to be passing--i.e. if the monsters feel contrived and not "real"--I'll be mildly annoyed, but I'll roll with it.</span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000">Cheap tactics can include things like using huge numbers of low-CR drow warriors to abuse the difficulty-construction rules, using large numbers of gimmicky monsters, etc. I'm telling you right now that if you throw me a Hard encounter in which 14 Intellect Devourers suddenly teleport on top of my party, I will undoubtedly lose. If you're thinking about something like this, tell me now and let's just save time by acknowledging that yes, you can indeed TPK the party long before encounter #8.</span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000">BTW, can I get a ruling in advance on how you run heavy obscurement? PHB rules make it unidirectional (can see out of a Fog Cloud or Darkness sphere but not in). I can roll with either interpretation but I would like to know in advance which you use.</span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><strong>Contact info:</strong> I'm <a href="mailto:wilson.max@gmail.com">wilson.max@gmail.com</a></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000">* Uber-cheap trick that just occurred to me: for low-CR creatures, Legendary Resistance is free per DMG guidelines. Pair a huge number of Legendary Resists with Undead Fortitude and Trollish Regeneration and you have a nigh-unkillable monster which dies only to crits and radiant damage, and even then only if you blocked its regeneration. Naturally a true munchkin DM would want to still stack with with other cheap tricks like Nimble Escape and high mobility + incorporeal movement, etc. I would never do this in real life to my players but that's the kind of thing I was referring to.</span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="FormerlyHemlock, post: 6864244, member: 6787650"] Yes to multiclassing and feats. No thanks to optional point buy variant. I'd rather stick to PHB rolled stats. Please roll stats for me in your capacity as DM, or if you'd rather not I will do it myself, but it's better if you do. You can use [URL]http://www.brockjones.com/dieroller/dice.htm[/URL] if you want something that is easy to copy/paste. [B]Edit:[/B] It will be better and simpler if my PCs have no magic items. That's my preferred style anyway. [COLOR=#000000] I think it will be obvious if you use exploits as cheap as the ones I have in mind, e.g. CR 1/4 monsters that can kill entire 10th level parties by exploiting the DMG's monster-construction rules*. As long as you stick to stuff that you would actually consider using in a real adventure we should be fine. If you do something silly like give all the monsters truesight and letting them ignore PC stealth and just pop out of the hidden rooms exactly when the PCs happen to be passing--i.e. if the monsters feel contrived and not "real"--I'll be mildly annoyed, but I'll roll with it. Cheap tactics can include things like using huge numbers of low-CR drow warriors to abuse the difficulty-construction rules, using large numbers of gimmicky monsters, etc. I'm telling you right now that if you throw me a Hard encounter in which 14 Intellect Devourers suddenly teleport on top of my party, I will undoubtedly lose. If you're thinking about something like this, tell me now and let's just save time by acknowledging that yes, you can indeed TPK the party long before encounter #8. BTW, can I get a ruling in advance on how you run heavy obscurement? PHB rules make it unidirectional (can see out of a Fog Cloud or Darkness sphere but not in). I can roll with either interpretation but I would like to know in advance which you use. [B]Contact info:[/B] I'm [EMAIL="wilson.max@gmail.com"]wilson.max@gmail.com[/EMAIL] * Uber-cheap trick that just occurred to me: for low-CR creatures, Legendary Resistance is free per DMG guidelines. Pair a huge number of Legendary Resists with Undead Fortitude and Trollish Regeneration and you have a nigh-unkillable monster which dies only to crits and radiant damage, and even then only if you blocked its regeneration. Naturally a true munchkin DM would want to still stack with with other cheap tricks like Nimble Escape and high mobility + incorporeal movement, etc. I would never do this in real life to my players but that's the kind of thing I was referring to.[/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
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Design Debate: 13th-level PCs vs. 6- to 8-Encounter Adventuring Day
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