D&D 3E/3.5 Dispel Magic changed in 3.5?

[Gansk]

My DM believes that Dispel Magic has changed in v3.5 because the word "spell" is no longer listed as a possible target in the heading, even though the descriptive text still mentions targeting a specific spell.

My question is - are either or both of the following scenarios legal?

Scenario A) A wizard sees a stinking cloud spell already in effect, and the edge of the cloud is within range of dispel magic. Can he or she say "I dispel the stinking cloud" instead of casting an area dispel and be forced to guess where the cloud originated?

Scenario B) A wizard notices that another party member seems to be subject to a confusion spell. Can he or she say "I dispel the confusion spell on my friend" instead of casting a targeted dispel on the party member and risk cancelling other helpful spells already cast?

 

[Thanee]

A) Yes, he can say that. And he can even dispel it that way.

Also, I don't think you need to hit the point of origin in either way (targeted or area dispel), just some part of the spell effect.

B) That's where I'm not sure. I think you need a way to see the target of the spell (i.e. Arcane Sight, maybe Detect Magic is enough, too), altho we usually play that it works as you describe it, that the knowledge of the presence of the spell is enough.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Gansk]

Actually, if you do use area dispel, your area needs to include the point of origin, otherwise you only partially cancel the spell (any part of the spell effect that overlaps with the dispel area is cancelled).

As for scenario B, my DM says that only Break Enchantment can strip off the Confusion without risking the other spells to cancellation.

 

[Thanee]

Ah, you're right about the point of origin, missed that part when checking the spell earlier.

Hmm... then the targeted dispel would have to be directed against that point, too, to be effective, I suppose.

As for B), if A) is a yes (well, the text clearly states, that spells can be targeted), then B) should work, too, but the targeting limits are still in effect, so, as said above, you would probably need some means to actually see the spell.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Saeviomagy]

I think that the inclusion of the word "spell" in the description of the targeted dispel is erroneous. I don't think it should be there. The rest of the text gives no information as to how to deal with a specific, targeted spell.

Given that, you must indeed hit the stinking cloud's point of origin with an area dispel magic. Note that because of the areas of effect of dispel and stinking cloud, you will always get the spell's origin (and therefore eradicate the entire spell) when you centre the dispel on any part of the cloud.

Also - you can't just dispel the confusion effect on your friend. You must go through each effect in order.

 

[Gansk]

So there is one vote for and one vote against. Does anybody want to break the tie?

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Saev -

Why can't you dispel the Confusion on your friend, assuming you knew it was a Confusion spell (probably via a Spellcraft roll)?

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Also - you can't just dispel the confusion effect on your friend. You must go through each effect in order.

As I understand it, this is only true if you select your friend as the target of the dispel magic. You can target only the confusion spell, and not risk dispelling beneficial spells. If there are multiple spells you wish to dispel, then, you have the choice of targetting your friend and trying to remove all of them, but risk dispelling any beneficial spells, or casting multiple dispel magics to dispel them individually.

There is some ambiguity in exactly how a wizard can target a spell he can't see. Hong suggested in a previous thread, and I also rule, that the wizard can make a spellcraft check to successfully target a non-visible spell with dispel magic.

Or that's how I understand it.

 

[Kelleris]

Hmmm... A related question I've wondered about:

Can you voluntarily fail dispel rolls? Say you have a specific effect in mind that group of foes is using, can you area dispel them and fail the checks until it filters down to the effect you most want to get rid of?

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Nope.