Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Divine Challenge at the end of your turn
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="AverageTable" data-source="post: 4359786" data-attributes="member: 71718"><p>Yes, this first interpretation is correct.</p><p> </p><p>Remember that the Divine Challenge persists until the paladin specifically challenges a different target or fails to engage the challenged target.</p><p> </p><p>The phrase "you must engage the target you challenged <strong>or challenge a different target</strong>" does not mean that challenging a different target <em>by itself</em> is sufficient to meet the condition. Rather, this caveat is included to account for cases where the paladin challenged a target on the <em>previous</em> turn (and did, indeed, engage it that turn), is <em>still</em> challenging it at the start of his current turn (because the challenge persists until he ends it or fails to engage), but the paladin wishes to use this turn to challenge <em>and engage</em> a different target on this second turn.</p><p> </p><p>For example:</p><p> </p><p>Turn 1: The paladin challenges Orc A and engages Orc A (by attacking this orc or ending his turn adjacent to this orc).</p><p> </p><p>Turn 2: Because the paladin <em>did</em> engage Orc A on Turn 1, he is <em>still</em> engaging Orc A at the start of Turn 2. He now has two options for how to spend Turn 2 without losing his Divine Challenge ability on Turn 3. He can either:</p><p> </p><p>(a) engage Orc A once more on Turn 2. This will meet the requirements and cause him to still be challenging Orc A at the start of Turn 3.</p><p> </p><p>or</p><p> </p><p>(b) use Divine Challenge on a different target, say Orc B, and <em>engage</em> Orc B on this same turn. He will then still be challenging Orc B at the start of Turn 3.</p><p> </p><p>He <em>cannot</em>, however, do the following:</p><p> </p><p>(c) use his standard and move actions for other unrelated things, and then end his turn by using his minor action to challenge Orc B.</p><p> </p><p>If he could do this, it would open up the same abuse that Divine Challenge was rewritten to avoid - challenging a target and running away. Observe:</p><p> </p><p>Paladin Turn 1: The paladin does something or other and then challenges Orc A (without ending Turn 1 adjacent to Orc A).</p><p> </p><p>Orc A Turn 1: Orc A is challenged and cannot attack anyone but the paladin without taking damage. He is forced to either move to the paladin (possibly taking opportunity attacks in the process) or waste his turn doing virtually nothing (or suffering automatic damage).</p><p> </p><p>Paladin Turn 2: The paladin begins this turn still challenging Orc A. He thens spends this turn completely ignoring Orc A. He ends this turn by using Divine Challenge on Orc B (whom he has also been completely ignoring). If we allow the explotive interpretation of "or challenge a different target", then the paladin has fully satisfied this requirement.</p><p> </p><p>Orc B Turn 2: Orc B is in the same situation that Orc A previously was. He either moves to the paladin who has been ignoring him or wastes his turn doing virtually notihing.</p><p> </p><p>Paladin Turn 3: The paladin begins this turn still challenging Orc B. He then spends this turn completely ignoring Orc B. He ends this turn by using Divine Challenge on Orc C.</p><p> </p><p>Repeat.</p><p> </p><p>Long story short: The paladin must engage a target on the <em>same turn</em> he challenges that target or the challenge will end and he will lose use of Divine Challenge for a turn.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AverageTable, post: 4359786, member: 71718"] Yes, this first interpretation is correct. Remember that the Divine Challenge persists until the paladin specifically challenges a different target or fails to engage the challenged target. The phrase "you must engage the target you challenged [b]or challenge a different target[/b]" does not mean that challenging a different target [i]by itself[/i] is sufficient to meet the condition. Rather, this caveat is included to account for cases where the paladin challenged a target on the [i]previous[/i] turn (and did, indeed, engage it that turn), is [i]still[/i] challenging it at the start of his current turn (because the challenge persists until he ends it or fails to engage), but the paladin wishes to use this turn to challenge [i]and engage[/i] a different target on this second turn. For example: Turn 1: The paladin challenges Orc A and engages Orc A (by attacking this orc or ending his turn adjacent to this orc). Turn 2: Because the paladin [i]did[/i] engage Orc A on Turn 1, he is [i]still[/i] engaging Orc A at the start of Turn 2. He now has two options for how to spend Turn 2 without losing his Divine Challenge ability on Turn 3. He can either: (a) engage Orc A once more on Turn 2. This will meet the requirements and cause him to still be challenging Orc A at the start of Turn 3. or (b) use Divine Challenge on a different target, say Orc B, and [i]engage[/i] Orc B on this same turn. He will then still be challenging Orc B at the start of Turn 3. He [i]cannot[/i], however, do the following: (c) use his standard and move actions for other unrelated things, and then end his turn by using his minor action to challenge Orc B. If he could do this, it would open up the same abuse that Divine Challenge was rewritten to avoid - challenging a target and running away. Observe: Paladin Turn 1: The paladin does something or other and then challenges Orc A (without ending Turn 1 adjacent to Orc A). Orc A Turn 1: Orc A is challenged and cannot attack anyone but the paladin without taking damage. He is forced to either move to the paladin (possibly taking opportunity attacks in the process) or waste his turn doing virtually nothing (or suffering automatic damage). Paladin Turn 2: The paladin begins this turn still challenging Orc A. He thens spends this turn completely ignoring Orc A. He ends this turn by using Divine Challenge on Orc B (whom he has also been completely ignoring). If we allow the explotive interpretation of "or challenge a different target", then the paladin has fully satisfied this requirement. Orc B Turn 2: Orc B is in the same situation that Orc A previously was. He either moves to the paladin who has been ignoring him or wastes his turn doing virtually notihing. Paladin Turn 3: The paladin begins this turn still challenging Orc B. He then spends this turn completely ignoring Orc B. He ends this turn by using Divine Challenge on Orc C. Repeat. Long story short: The paladin must engage a target on the [i]same turn[/i] he challenges that target or the challenge will end and he will lose use of Divine Challenge for a turn. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Divine Challenge at the end of your turn
Top