DM Dilemma - I Need Help, ENWorld! - *UPDATED* - Putting YOUR ideas to work!

[Gloomshroud]

I do a lot of the same things you do. I have my note book with my lists of badies and treasures and such. and i write down and "general outline" nothing super serious. Have those KEY story elements you want to happen, happen. Your the DM so you can guide or intice your players to "story scene" fairly easilly.

Don't over think it. Not every room in every tower or dungeon or abandon castle has to have a story element. And when i've done that in the past my players have gotten worn down by it quickly. Don't worry yourself with pre set maps either. If the players do the map but skip room X where a story element were to take place, simply move the room into their path. In that same fashion, if they are out in the city or town or whatever and the arent going where you need them to go, send the story to them. have a messanger waiting to tell them somthing.

When it comes to writing out giant sections of of plot, i don't. I write out things that have to happen no matter what. for a lot of the everyday stuff i wing it. i've also written a letter on the computer. printed it out and left it for them find in a dungeon as there next clue.

If your worried about writing out everystep of a dungeon crawl, what i do sometimes is take different sections of different dungeons from premade games. printed them out on the comp. and run with those as my dungeon. for my story lines i try to keep it interesting and fun, but open so the players can have some influence on it. and if they do something like, kill someone they should have let live, i'll makea concequence for that later. i think of my story lines like the alphabet. the players are going to get to b then c then d no matter what. but if the do something bad in b then maybe c takes longer or is costly to them.

I love story telling and love it even more when the group plays in character. It is one of the best things of DnD. Perhaps it would be better if you wrote your story out like, A then D. and how they get from a to d is up to them. but no matter what have those story lines ready to happen at A and D no matter what.

Anothre thing I do to reward my players for listening and particpating in more than just fights is, i ask everyone to email me a game summary and the best one gets som extra xp. it makes everyone have a more vested interest in the story. it's also made one of my players a entire level higher then the rest of the group.

I hope my rambling somewhat helped. Good luck. Your players are lucky to have a DM dedicated to the story as much as your are.

Wow! That's a gold mine! Thanks! However, I'll be so brazen as to ask you to expound on a couple points:

and i write down and "general outline" nothing super serious. Have those KEY story elements you want to happen, happen. Your the DM so you can guide or intice your players to "story scene" fairly easilly.

Can you give me an EXAMPLE of what this would look like?

...take different sections of different dungeons from premade games. printed them out on the comp. and run with those as my dungeon...

Yup, me too. I have trouble "tailoring" it to my party, though.

but open so the players can have some influence on it. and if they do something like, kill someone they should have let live, i'll makea concequence for that later. i think of my story lines like the alphabet. the players are going to get to b then c then d no matter what. but if the do something bad in b then maybe c takes longer or is costly to them.

May I have an example of this, as well?

Anothre thing I do to reward my players for listening and particpating

I also do this, though I never know what's worth how much, you know?

 

[Gloomshroud]

0) Examine campaign current situation for interesting situation -- look at loose ends and unresolved conflicts for inspiration.

1) Decide on the basic structure of the situation -- exploration of static environment, response to other's action, proactive party action.

2) Decide on any thematic elements in the situation.

3) Decide on expected threat level and reward level.

4) Decide on what campaign elements will be reflected in the adventure. What NPCs, both individual and groups, will be represented and/or interested in the situation, location, McGiuffin, etc.

5) Decide how much each group knows, how much involvement is each is willing to commit for their current knowledge, and each group's goals. Assign a starting involvement for each group and likely evolution of their involvement.

6) Using broad strokes, decide how different situational resolutions will impact the various groups and the campaign in general. This step can often be skipped if the adventure will have very limited impact on the campaign universe.

7) Run the adventure.

8) Assign consequences and impacts based upon actual resolution of the situation.

Thanks! Another EXCELLENT reply. I notice you use the word "decide" quite a lot. I also understand this basic outline you've laid out...what I have trouble with are the actual DECISIONS. So, more to the point, HOW do you decide these things? What are your thought processes? Also, this will be the first adventure of a new Dark Sun campaign...so I need to start with a BANG, you know?

 

[Gloomshroud]

As I'm reading these great responses, it occurs to me that perhaps an example of my REAL LIFE dilemma would merit explanation. So here's the deal:

Dark Sun Adventure Campaign Arc

Heroic: Recover Dark Lens
- Kalak is alive, not bad, and pulls the heroes from another plane through the Gray

Paragon: Defeat a (de-leveled) Dragon of Tyr
-Gain access to the Hollow where Rajaat is...I want to involve Rajaat somehow

Epic: Restore Athas and/or gods
- Defeat Sorcerer King(s)

That's my basic concept. It's rough, but workable.

Now, that was FINE, no problem. But when I sit down to actually MAKE my first adventure, here's what I know:

• I want them to be teleported in to the harshness of Dark Sun from somewhere else (i.e. they are the only hope, prophecies tell of the coming of heroes, etc)
• I want Kalak to be their contact (he's not the evil deposed tyrant in actuality, just defamed as such after being usurped - in MY dark sun, anyways).
• I want them to suffer the desert a bit, then meet up with someone in the city of Tyr (a member of the True, probably). I am AWFUL at city adventures. Nothing I've ever read or done has helped me run one successfully.

So, given this, how would YOU prepare the first adventure? You see? I get stuck staring at a blank piece of paper trying to figure out how to sort this all out in a manner that's situational and useful...

 

[ExploderWizard]

Now, that was FINE, no problem. But when I sit down to actually MAKE my first adventure, here's what I know:

• I want them to be teleported in to the harshness of Dark Sun from somewhere else (i.e. they are the only hope, prophecies tell of the coming of heroes, etc)
• I want Kalak to be their contact (he's not the evil deposed tyrant in actuality, just defamed as such after being usurped - in MY dark sun, anyways).
• I want them to suffer the desert a bit, then meet up with someone in the city of Tyr (a member of the True, probably). I am AWFUL at city adventures. Nothing I've ever read or done has helped me run one successfully.

So, given this, how would YOU prepare the first adventure? You see? I get stuck staring at a blank piece of paper trying to figure out how to sort this all out in a manner that's situational and useful...

I would start by trying not to determine so many events that involve the PC's. Figuring how to get the PC's into such pre-conceived events would be difficult for me too.

 

[Ogrehatescomputers]

Sure no problem. For a general outline I may write something like this. (in fact this is mine for my current game) Oh and for this campaign my players characters all know eachother and are part of a small adventuring guild. They are level 4.

Plot: Adentures are gathering in the small town of ______ for the chance to explore the mage tower of _______ In a bid to raise money for his poverty striken town the mayor has removed the ban on venturing into the tower. The tower is said to have driven the old mage mad. No one knows what secrets and treasures are held within.

So there is the basic origin plot and why they are there. then i wrote other things down. to help me and them.

Key points in and about the town:

Many adventrues have gathered here. Both good and bad. All vying for the chance to go the tower next. (possible conflict mary arise between one or more of the parties)

There are only a dozen or so buidling in the town and the rest are farmers homes and small huts. (so i have the key places you would need. A blacksmith a market an inn. etc.)

The inn is where you must go to meet the mayor and place your names for a chance to go to the tower next. The the players discover an entry fee and a waiting list. Also the will see other groups of people waiting to go.have some eager and willing, others beaten down and preparing to leave, defeated. (if your players are smart they will drill the leaving party for info) have them give some obscure details about a trap that killed or hurt one of there comrades. or a monster that drove them back. Or have them pay them for a map of the first two floors... Here the mayor will inform them that they are the next group inline after the the ______ guild goes in tommorrow.

other buildings will redirect questions to inn.

have the party stay whereever. the next day have one member of the ______ guild return in a panic begging help for his friends who are now missing. now they have an npc guide through the tower. depending on party reactions and gameplay i may have the npc be evil or have him be grateful for the help and reward them. i expect my players to adhere to the character they have chosen and his allignment and everything else.

for the tower i have different rooms of different dungeons and a couple of my own. some of the more nasty ones are uprgaded temple of elemental evil rooms.

so my story elements so far are A: the opening idea and B the "rescue of the previous party" along the way the have the chance of alienating and making a enemy of the npc. or befriending him and making a strong ally for use later.

then i have written down my "alphabet"

A: story open
B: rescue other guild
C: guild either rescued and befriended, or half are rescued and turn into your enemy.
D: a few floors of the tower
E: while resting back in town befro going back to the tower a fight occurs of who goes next. tensions are high since your group has now gone longer than any other. if the othre guild is your friend now then they will help you. if not, they may try to kidnap one of your party. If they are friends then you will help the townspeople find the now captive mayor instead.
F: now they are side questing. and the villains are either the other guild who you have made one way or another. or a thieves guild wanting ransom. i have the theives made either way because if they dont fight them now, they may later.
G: one way or the other. the plots of E and F are resolved.
H: now another group has gone on to the tower without the mayors knowledge...
I: arriving in the tower yourselves you see they have cleaned out another level of the tower. In the one above that, they will meet this new guild. Who, if the players fought the thieves are wearing the same cloaks and broaches as them, or if the players fought the other guild, then are wearing theirs.


and so on and so fourth.

for the matter of resolving xp. I give one quarter of what the xp was that previous adventre to the winner of the "contest"

hope it helps.

 

[Gloomshroud]

Wow, this is nice! Thanks!

 

[Nagol]

I find first adventure problematic since I don’t have a lot of loose ends or knowledge as to what the PCs find interesting yet.

Here is an example.

Situation chosen
The PCs know of a baronry nearby that was owned by a previous LE adventurer. The adventurer is MIA and has been for a few years. His LN consort has been acting as custodian, and dealing with a rebellious populace as she believes her husband would. The elder son is CE and about to ascend to the throne. His younger son is NG and a cleric trying to undo some of the damage the father caused in his lifetime.

Players

1. Elder son – wants to ascend to throne; preferentially while removing his brother from any claim (stats generated previously). Unwilling to take proactive action, but will be opportunistic if the situation presents itself.
2. Younger son – returning to family estate; wants to arrive safely carrying a McGuffin as a gift for his brother’s ascension; wants to sway brother into a softer course for the baronry, but isn’t hopeful. Rarely discusses ancestry with outsiders – sort of embarrassed. (stats generated).
3. Mother – happy to step down. Trying to moderate son’s behaviour. Believes populace would be better served by a lighter hand than an iron fist. Wants to see both son’s again (stats generated previously)
4. Rebels – want to kidnap brother to extract ransom/concessions from new baron. (stats generated)
5. Religious order – releasing younger brother from duties to attend family event. Knows of ancestry and warns younger brother to seek protection on the trip. (stats unnecessary)

Initial situation
Younger brother approaches players looking for paid escort to barony. Reasons: knows PCs have been there recently; taking warning to heart; carrying ascension gift worth a few hundred gold (McGuffin that attaches to a different adventure seed that the party may notice)

Workload

1. Younger brother will be assaulted on road by rebels. Attack statted out with indication as to how the attackers will know the correct group / location to strike.
2. Ransom note written to be found on rebels if defeated or to be left on doorstep if successful.
3. Kidnapping hideout statted out in case attack is successful and rescue attempt is launched.
4. Further optional adventure seeds created for party activity if the group attends the ascension (further escorts, rebellion suppression, recon mission). Availability of adventures depends on relationship with family after the situation resolution.

 

[Nagol]

As I'm reading these great responses, it occurs to me that perhaps an example of my REAL LIFE dilemma would merit explanation. So here's the deal:

Dark Sun Adventure Campaign Arc

Heroic: Recover Dark Lens
- Kalak is alive, not bad, and pulls the heroes from another plane through the Gray

Paragon: Defeat a (de-leveled) Dragon of Tyr
-Gain access to the Hollow where Rajaat is...I want to involve Rajaat somehow

Epic: Restore Athas and/or gods
- Defeat Sorcerer King(s)

That's my basic concept. It's rough, but workable.

Now, that was FINE, no problem. But when I sit down to actually MAKE my first adventure, here's what I know:

• I want them to be teleported in to the harshness of Dark Sun from somewhere else (i.e. they are the only hope, prophecies tell of the coming of heroes, etc)
• I want Kalak to be their contact (he's not the evil deposed tyrant in actuality, just defamed as such after being usurped - in MY dark sun, anyways).
• I want them to suffer the desert a bit, then meet up with someone in the city of Tyr (a member of the True, probably). I am AWFUL at city adventures. Nothing I've ever read or done has helped me run one successfully.

So, given this, how would YOU prepare the first adventure? You see? I get stuck staring at a blank piece of paper trying to figure out how to sort this all out in a manner that's situational and useful...

There's a whole lot of points where the PCs can say "No. We go that away instead." What are you going to do then?

 

[Gloomshroud]

I find first adventure problematic since I don’t have a lot of loose ends or knowledge as to what the PCs find interesting yet.

Here is an example.

Situation chosen
The PCs know of a baronry nearby that was owned by a previous LE adventurer. The adventurer is MIA and has been for a few years. His LN consort has been acting as custodian, and dealing with a rebellious populace as she believes her husband would. The elder son is CE and about to ascend to the throne. His younger son is NG and a cleric trying to undo some of the damage the father caused in his lifetime.

Players

1. Elder son – wants to ascend to throne; preferentially while removing his brother from any claim (stats generated previously). Unwilling to take proactive action, but will be opportunistic if the situation presents itself.
2. Younger son – returning to family estate; wants to arrive safely carrying a McGuffin as a gift for his brother’s ascension; wants to sway brother into a softer course for the baronry, but isn’t hopeful. Rarely discusses ancestry with outsiders – sort of embarrassed. (stats generated).
3. Mother – happy to step down. Trying to moderate son’s behaviour. Believes populace would be better served by a lighter hand than an iron fist. Wants to see both son’s again (stats generated previously)
4. Rebels – want to kidnap brother to extract ransom/concessions from new baron. (stats generated)
5. Religious order – releasing younger brother from duties to attend family event. Knows of ancestry and warns younger brother to seek protection on the trip. (stats unnecessary)

Initial situation
Younger brother approaches players looking for paid escort to barony. Reasons: knows PCs have been there recently; taking warning to heart; carrying ascension gift worth a few hundred gold (McGuffin that attaches to a different adventure seed that the party may notice)

Workload

1. Younger brother will be assaulted on road by rebels. Attack statted out with indication as to how the attackers will know the correct group / location to strike.
2. Ransom note written to be found on rebels if defeated or to be left on doorstep if successful.
3. Kidnapping hideout statted out in case attack is successful and rescue attempt is launched.
4. Further optional adventure seeds created for party activity if the group attends the ascension (further escorts, rebellion suppression, recon mission). Availability of adventures depends on relationship with family after the situation resolution.

Ah, believe it or not, this is akin to what I do. You just did it 100x beter. >.<

 

[Gloomshroud]

There's a whole lot of points where the PCs can say "No. We go that away instead." What are you going to do then?

Bingo. You've hit the nail on the head. This is EXACTLY what I'm talking about when I said "I don't know how to DO situational preparation, even though I understand what it IS"

You see, I want these to be SITUATIONS, not chokepoints, rails, or bottlenecks. This is EXACTLY the intent of my questioning.

But ANY adventure is susceptible to a player saying "No." Even the one you outlined above. For example, you put:

Younger brother will be assaulted on road by rebels
I had an adventure in which a similar (escort) event occured. Instead of aiding their charge, they turned on him, killing him. The rebels assumed that these adventurers were on THEIR side. They killed the REBELS too, then. Took THEIR loot. Then they made it look as if they'd died heroically defending their prince (using the multiple dead raiders' bodies), took the loot, and ran away. These were CG/CN neutral PCs, btw. They decided that they hated the prince's laws and thought it'd be better to run him through. How would THAT affect your outlined adventure, hm? Totally derailed.