• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

Do castles make sense in a world of dragons & spells?

Obryn

Hero
Castles aren't in fantasy worlds because they're completely effective or sensible.

They're in fantasy worlds because the pseudo-medieval genre basically demands them. They're narratively and thematically appropriate, regardless of their effectiveness.

With that said, there are fantasy worlds without castles. But those aren't generally considered traditional fantasy, either.

-O
 

log in or register to remove this ad

ProfessorCirno

Banned
Banned
I think 4e has a much bigger issue then rituals - races.

You can always claim that high levels wizards are rare, but an entire army of level 1 eladrin foot soldiers can just teleport through all the defenses of the castle.
 


Stoat

Adventurer
I think 4e has a much bigger issue then rituals - races.

You can always claim that high levels wizards are rare, but an entire army of level 1 eladrin foot soldiers can just teleport through all the defenses of the castle.

It's a relatively short ranged power that requires line of sight. The defenders should be ok if they're careful about where they put their windows and they keep their walls high enough.
 

UngainlyTitan

Legend
Supporter
I think 4e has a much bigger issue then rituals - races.

You can always claim that high levels wizards are rare, but an entire army of level 1 eladrin foot soldiers can just teleport through all the defenses of the castle.
Feystep requires line of sight and that the ramparts are more than 30 feet tall, the reall issue with Eladrin is jail. Dark Oubliettes seem to be the only answer.

Randon thought: does feystep preserve velocity? 'Casue if it does not, then you could use catapults to fire eladrin at the walls and when their trajectory gets close enough they feystep to the walls, safely shedding their momentum.
:erm:
 

Theo R Cwithin

I cast "Baconstorm!"
Randon thought: does feystep preserve velocity? 'Casue if it does not, then you could use catapults to fire eladrin at the walls and when their trajectory gets close enough they feystep to the walls, safely shedding their momentum.
:erm:
The training exercises would be... messy.
 

interwyrm

First Post
does feystep preserve velocity? 'Casue if it does not, then you could use catapults to fire eladrin at the walls and when their trajectory gets close enough they feystep to the walls, safely shedding their momentum.
:erm:

I like your style, kid. Flavor text suggests otherwise though. If eladrin are taking a quick step through the feywild, I'd expect that a falling eladrin continues to fall through the feywild - which means they just end up teleporting 30 ft down.
 

Haltherrion

First Post
Do traditional castles make sense as defensive structures in a fantasy world of dragons and spells?
...

All this makes me think that a practical, realistic fortification in a typical fantasy world would have to look very different than a medieval castle. I have no idea what shapes and designs would actually work and prevail in such a world, they would certainly be time tested and function better than what I can come up with my imagination.

I think this is a great mental exercise. Certainly castle architecture in Europe was very dynamic with defenses evolving rapidly as offense changed. The high castle period that most people think of when thinking of castles was roughly 1150 to 1350. Not very long really and very much shaped by technology. Magic ought to have similar effect.

A lot will depend on your prevelance of magic and siege-lore but I find it personally hard to believe magic wouldn't have a significant effect.

I imagine castles becoming more closed on themselves with less open spaces and more of the look of tiered, interconnected blockhouses with one unit providing protection for the next (including protection over the roofs) and no large interior spaces like a courtyard. So more towers and keeps and less sprawling walls that can be hopped over with magic. Compartmentalization to mitigate abilities that allow you to penetrate walls. Alternately, maybe no expensive fortifications: if big stone castles are easily subverted with magic, why build them?

When considering magic and creatures, always good to consider in addition to flight, powerful earth/stone battering spells and creatures (elementals for instance) as well as underground creatures. In addition to providing access to the inside of a castle, an umber hulk could quickly excavate a mine for classic undermining operations.

And then the nature of the defenders may shape the fortification: griffon riders need places to house the griffins as well as launch and retrieve them. A castle with some giants in the garrison would have to accomodate them.

Lots of fun stuff to play with. I like castles and wouldn't run a fantasy world without them but usually modify them from the classic forms to meet at least the obvious threats.
 
Last edited:

howandwhy99

Adventurer
3 dimensional movement changes defensive design. As does gravity. Castles rarely have open tops for a reason too. And a dwarf hold is just as susceptible to attack as any other location in a 3D world. It's all a matter of movement type. Flying occurs through gaseous elements and is often thought of as the most common form of 3D movement. Actually, I think swimming through liquid elements is the most common and certainly a consideration in terms of fortification when in an aquatic environment. Tunneling and earthgliding are less common and often more difficult forms of movement and are usually not as often considered in defensive design. That dwarves and dwarf holds would design for such attacks makes sense.

All of this overlooks a 4th kind of movement as sort of brought up at the end of your post: extra-dimensional. Teleporting into the throne room of a castle is just as weak a defense as leaving the front gate open or having no walls. The enemy can potentially come to you anywhere.

My way of handling this is by rating each resource and defense against them upon a power scale. I use 1-10 which corresponds to the levels available in the world for almost everything: monsters, PCs, traps, spells, powers, magic items, and territory just to name a few.

There are forms of defense against all of these attacks in D&D, if you just look back at its' design. (Entering a territory/terrain is just as much an attack/invasion as any other kind of encroachment on others' resources). For me, when setting up combats I set equal forces against each other and let the PCs be the unaccounted for variable.
 


Voidrunner's Codex

Remove ads

Top