Do I hang in there, repair, or exit my Scales of War AP?

[catsclaw227]

OK gang --

I dig 4e, my group is playing it and we are taking some of the advice from the Stalker0 thread on Anti-Grind.

But I am playing the Scales of War AP and we are starting the Lost Mine of Karak (AP 4, level 6-7+), and I want to give the PCs more freedom. Do I exit the AP, reduce some of the encounters and let the PCs actions invent the rest (i.e. AP-sandbox hybrid), or do I hang in there and wait, because coming adventures are really awesome?

My guys want some of the minor encounters to go more quickly, so we are doing 1/2 HP and +level damage for monsters (or a variant thereof) to quicken the encounters and make them more swingy.

But I want them to discover their own PCs, and at this level (6th), they are really feeling their characters and I don't want to avoid letting them sow their individual oats. They like the story and have said that they enjoy what's gone on so far. At least in the Dungeon AP, there's no real feeling of overarching story in the first few modules.... the are loosely connected enough to fiddle around with them. Especially after reading ahead and seeing some really well done adventures.

Any suggestions?

What have you done to spice up your Scales of War AP? Did you bail on it and roll into something else? How do your players feel about the AP?

Lot's of queries for ideas here gang, so not topic is off topic with regards to APs in general, Scales of War AP, moving to and from APs (AoW, SavageTide, Paizo APs, etc).

Thanks in advance, gang. I really, really respect the way EnWorld respondents articulate themselves.

 

[RangerWickett]

Have you taken a look at E.N. Publishing's War of the Burning Sky campaign saga? Still war-themed, but with a much more definite overarching plot, and plenty of potential for the PCs to make names for themselves, and influence cities and entire nations. Since it's also war-themed, it wouldn't be too hard for you to shoehorn what you've already done on Scales of War into the low end of the WotBS campaign.

If you do stick with SoW, I'd find the encounters that aren't interesting, or that don't lend themselves to story/plot/character/etc. in the way you want. Then cut those out, but let the party level at the normal rate. It leaves more time for roleplaying.

Edit: Wait, actually, if I recall correctly, didn't you run a WotBS game for a while back in 3.5? You got to, what, adventure 4, then had to move or something? The 4e version is just now up to adventure 4, if you're interested.

 

[Maggan]

Do I exit the AP, reduce some of the encounters and let the PCs actions invent the rest (i.e. AP-sandbox hybrid), or do I hang in there and wait, because coming adventures are really awesome?

I'm leaving Scales of War, and instead seguing into Revenge of the Giants. The Scales of War never cought the interest of my players in the long term, even though they love the game. They only paid token attention to the plot, so I needed something they wanted to fight and care about fighting.

/M

 

[Jack99]

I am not running SoW, as I am a player in a SoW campaign.

I am personally not a big fan of AP's but they definitely have their uses. So, since your players seem to enjoy the SoW-story, my advice would be to not leave it. Instead, to accommodate the desires of your players, instead keep the overall plots, but tone down the dungeons to be 1/2 or 1/3 (whatever suits you really) size (not physical size, but in terms of number of combat encounters). Instead use the space gained to put in RP and exploration stuff.

Now, logically, this will affect the number of xp your players gain. If you do not want to cheapen the feeling too much and just have them level to follow the story, instead use the (xp)room gained to throw in your own stuff, small adventures that fit the area, but perhaps not the story. Or expand on things from the original story, maybe put an anonymous NPC more to the front or whatnot. The possibilities are endless.

This (IME) is the single best way to use AP's, whether made by WotC, Paizo, Necromancers or EN publishing. Anything else and it because very railroady and with way too many combat encounters.

Cheers

 

[catsclaw227]

Have you taken a look at E.N. Publishing's War of the Burning Sky campaign saga? Still war-themed, but with a much more definite overarching plot, and plenty of potential for the PCs to make names for themselves, and influence cities and entire nations. Since it's also war-themed, it wouldn't be too hard for you to shoehorn what you've already done on Scales of War into the low end of the WotBS campaign.

If you do stick with SoW, I'd find the encounters that aren't interesting, or that don't lend themselves to story/plot/character/etc. in the way you want. Then cut those out, but let the party level at the normal rate. It leaves more time for roleplaying.

Edit: Wait, actually, if I recall correctly, didn't you run a WotBS game for a while back in 3.5? You got to, what, adventure 4, then had to move or something? The 4e version is just now up to adventure 4, if you're interested.

Yes, you are right, I did run WotBS for 3.5 until adventure 4 or so and then moved (nice memory and/or good search-fu for confirmation )

I was also running WotBS 4e for an online MapTools game, and it was awesome, but there were too many real-world obstacles and I didn't have the time to run and prep two games, so the Maptools game (unfortunately) got the axe.

I really like WotBS though and have been considering how I can move to it, but I think I want to do something that provides a bit more sandboxy feel. Even if it is a series of episodic adventures very loosely tied together or mini-APs.

Though the guys don't feel like they are on a train, I can sense that they want some more freedom. They don't want to kill the story (they like story) but would like more of the story to be as much about them as it is about some overarching world-saving story.

 

[vagabundo]

If the players are enjoying their characters and the story - so far - build on it.

Maybe use some of the chaos scar side treks and weave in a few extra plots.

I actually ran the Mines of Karak (outside of the SOW), but riped out many of the encounters and redesigned the lower levels - a hidden mine enterance made no sense to me; how do the miners get the ore out?? I inserted a large ramp/floor section, the mechanism was broken and I had the bad guys trigger it as a trap - it caused a large cave in.

My PC's scared off the Trog's through a dip skill challenge too, they convinced them a human army was being sent to retake the keep.

The dungeon needs spicing up - add some cultists and a some additional ways in. My guys came in through the roof and killed the harpys before entering the keep proper.

 

[catsclaw227]

This is some good advice about Karak. My PCs just descended out of hte Thornwaste and are about to see the first indication of the adventure BBEG influence with the village encounter.

 

[Treebore]

AP's are only ever my "main plot", I always allow divergences when the players take the initiative to do their own thing. Plus I enjoy the challenge of redoing things to make it all still fit together after all is said and done.

 

[vagabundo]

Oh I also had another expedition from that other clan - the hammerers? hammerfists? - who were looking to loot, and maybe take over the mine.

However they ran into the trogs and only one lived to tell the tale. Giving the PC's some good information and an extra companion; he was evil and quickly switched clan loyalty to save his own skin.