Do my homework for me
- Thread starter TuDogz
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dcollins
Explorer
Researching original spells is strictly up to the DM's adjudication (it's in the midst of a series of rule variants, DMG p. 41-42). Some bullet points:
- There's nothing in the section that expressly forbids it (DMG p. 42). Divine casters can share spells via a scroll or "special text" (PHB p. 156).
- Personally, I dislike the whole idea of divine, non-spontaneous casters researching new spells. (It increases their power significantly and raises the question of why didn't the deity make it available in the first place.)
- If your plan is to have an NPC do it, there's absolutely no rules for negotiating or charging for that kind of service, so again, it's up to the DM.
- There's nothing in the section that expressly forbids it (DMG p. 42). Divine casters can share spells via a scroll or "special text" (PHB p. 156).
- Personally, I dislike the whole idea of divine, non-spontaneous casters researching new spells. (It increases their power significantly and raises the question of why didn't the deity make it available in the first place.)
- If your plan is to have an NPC do it, there's absolutely no rules for negotiating or charging for that kind of service, so again, it's up to the DM.
Murrdox
First Post
So thus Divine casters have a completely static spell list which can never be altered except by the Gods?
I dunno if I really like THAT idea. So Bane comes up with a spell called Blade Barrier, and then his followers just somehow know to begin praying for it. The other Gods see Bane's followers casting Blade Barrier, and then they grant this spell to THEIR followers as well. Seems kinda silly.
This is all just my opinion... bouncing ideas off you guys. Suppose instead that the CLERICS come up with the spells, the gods just provide the energy and the means to cast them. For example, Jozan prays for "the power to smite his enemies with beams of light from his hands". The prayer invokes how the power from the god will be used. In essence, he's praying for "Searing Light". Now, if he wanted to pray for a version of "Searing Light" which was composed of negative energy as opposed to Light... well, Jozan hasn't been taught a prayer for that kind of power before. It's going to take some meditation and research into religious texts to determine exactly WHAT kind of power he should ask be granted to him. He doesn't want to request a power too high level for him, or too insignificant either... finally, after some research into it, he's sure of the exact type of power he must pray for. He does so, and has thus researched "Baneful Light" or whatever you want to call it... a 4th level spell that acts like "Searing Light" only it is composed of Negative Energy. Jozan can now teach the means to pray for this spell to other clerics. If his god is particularly pleased with Jozan and his new spell, he may inspire other clerics to pray for it, and then other gods may start granting it to THEIR followers, and so on.
I dunno if I really like THAT idea. So Bane comes up with a spell called Blade Barrier, and then his followers just somehow know to begin praying for it. The other Gods see Bane's followers casting Blade Barrier, and then they grant this spell to THEIR followers as well. Seems kinda silly.
This is all just my opinion... bouncing ideas off you guys. Suppose instead that the CLERICS come up with the spells, the gods just provide the energy and the means to cast them. For example, Jozan prays for "the power to smite his enemies with beams of light from his hands". The prayer invokes how the power from the god will be used. In essence, he's praying for "Searing Light". Now, if he wanted to pray for a version of "Searing Light" which was composed of negative energy as opposed to Light... well, Jozan hasn't been taught a prayer for that kind of power before. It's going to take some meditation and research into religious texts to determine exactly WHAT kind of power he should ask be granted to him. He doesn't want to request a power too high level for him, or too insignificant either... finally, after some research into it, he's sure of the exact type of power he must pray for. He does so, and has thus researched "Baneful Light" or whatever you want to call it... a 4th level spell that acts like "Searing Light" only it is composed of Negative Energy. Jozan can now teach the means to pray for this spell to other clerics. If his god is particularly pleased with Jozan and his new spell, he may inspire other clerics to pray for it, and then other gods may start granting it to THEIR followers, and so on.
In this particular situation I am the dm. The cleric is pregnant and very vain. She has no desire to be seen in her social circles in her current condition but cannot disappear for the remainder of her pregnancy. She has contemplated aborting the babies (7 of them) but has asked about researching a spell to transfer the children into the wombs of willing surrogate mothers. Obviously she may be able to get someone to research and cast the spell for her but she is interested in having the spell herself since it is within her capabilities.
As far as not adding to a divine caster's spell list this is obviously not a game breaking spell.
As far as not adding to a divine caster's spell list this is obviously not a game breaking spell.
Savage Wombat
Hero
Considering the unlikeliness of the spell's reuse later in the campaign, and the major complications of the ritual, I'd suggest the Miracle spell is in order.
Also - I permit clerical spell research, simply because I don't want every cleric in the world to have to choose between every spell published in every sourcebook I use. I don't require a tremendous cash investment, but I do require some sort of special role-playing investment, such as a quest or pilgrimage.
Also - I permit clerical spell research, simply because I don't want every cleric in the world to have to choose between every spell published in every sourcebook I use. I don't require a tremendous cash investment, but I do require some sort of special role-playing investment, such as a quest or pilgrimage.
I was thinking about setting the spell at 5th level. It is seems equivalent in form and function to a combination of dimension door and poly other. It is obviously of very limited use.
Miracle seems like an awfully big gun.
As far as spell research for clerics goes, I like having clerics research spells to personalize thier character. Particularly spells within their domains. Many of the domain spells seem like they were shoehorned into place to fill all nine slots rather than go through the effort to develop more pertinent spells for the inherently restricted criteria. Balance is always an issue but signature spells that reflect the ideals of the god and make the cleric unique only help the campaign.
Miracle seems like an awfully big gun.
As far as spell research for clerics goes, I like having clerics research spells to personalize thier character. Particularly spells within their domains. Many of the domain spells seem like they were shoehorned into place to fill all nine slots rather than go through the effort to develop more pertinent spells for the inherently restricted criteria. Balance is always an issue but signature spells that reflect the ideals of the god and make the cleric unique only help the campaign.
RigaMortus
Explorer
Why make it a spell? Why not make it a ritual she researches? In this ritual, she has to maybe "collect" certain items, assemble them at a certain place, or certain time of day, under certain conditions... Anyway, this could open up a good opportunity for a quest for the Cleric. And it wouldn't make you have to come up with a new spell, which would have a very limited use anyway.
cptg1481
First Post
7 Babies?????
OK my interest in peaked what race is the cleric in question?
I only ask becuse 7 is a symbolic number and was curious if the births were divinely inspired multiples or the usual for her race i.e. a gnoll let say.
So not sharp shooting or questioning you just peaked my interest.
OK my interest in peaked what race is the cleric in question?
I only ask becuse 7 is a symbolic number and was curious if the births were divinely inspired multiples or the usual for her race i.e. a gnoll let say.
So not sharp shooting or questioning you just peaked my interest.
hey the cleric in question is mine, she is a cleric/divine agent of olidammara's. the father of the babies is a tiefling that she seduced to get some information that she needed. she has a high charisma and yes she is very vain. she does not want to abort the babies she is curious what they will be like but she has no intentions of giving birth. she is not the motherly type.
WattsHumphrey
First Post
Murrdox said:
Actually, I kind of like the idea that clerics can't research spells and that their lists are static.
In Magic of Faerun, there are a lot of spells that list who came up with them. I'm not entirely sure if it's meant to say that the clerics did or the deity did, but either way, it was a spell that was designed with a god in mind... and the other spellcasters just found it useful and prayed to their God for it.
