Do you find the CR/EL system useful when writing adventures?

[Psion]

I pretty much agree. It's not a substitute for knowing your party's strengths and weaknesses, but I learned early on that second guessing some CRs mid-game wasn't a great idea. Sometimes that number is a better estimate than I could come up with at a glance.

They did have some problems with some higher CR creatures, and there is still some unavoidable variance at higher levels, but generally thing that they are getting better at estimating higher CR creatures.

 

[kigmatzomat]

I think the CR/EL system actually helps develop DM judgement. In the 2E days you had no real guidelines for evaluating the threat of a creature; you're only "universal" summation of risk was the XP value and it was incomplete as the total XP value depended greatly on the loot.

I treat it as a tool for making a rough draft. A few minutes with the MMs and I can have a reasonably close encounter. I then examine the encounters as a whole. Are there synergies that make them stronger? Are there points of opposition that will cause them to actually become weaker? (e.g. a medusa + something that causes blindness)

The CR system is something you can get a feel for. People have an idea what a CR5 should be. They can look at a creature and think "is this in line with a CR5?" It is much simpler to decide if a given creature should have a certain CR than to develop a CR system from scratch. And once DMs are comfortable adjusting the CR/ELs to match their party, they will have more confidence to make other changes to the "recommended guidelines" of running a game.

 

[helium3]

HOWEVER, the lack of an accurate CR calculation system in the game (both for PC & Monster) is one of the most frustrating elements of adventure design in modern D&D!

There is a section in the back of the MM that talks about estimating CR for monsters of your own creation. My guess is that there is no rigid mechanic for calculating CR. Instead you compare your opponent to creatures in the MM that have been playtested to a specific CR.

 

[lukelightning]

I've found that my players can easily beat thing that are a higher CR than they are, but that's not a fault of the CR system. Instead it's because I'm not the best tactician; after all, they have 4 brains versus my one brain.

 

[diaglo]

i am a referee.

when reading adventures/modules i find it useful. it helps me to understand what the designer was trying to accomplish.

when in actual play. no, it doesn't work for me mostly.

 

[Glyfair]

I think the CR/EL system actually helps develop DM judgement. In the 2E days you had no real guidelines for evaluating the threat of a creature; you're only "universal" summation of risk was the XP value and it was incomplete as the total XP value depended greatly on the loot.

Yes. One thing I noticed about beginning DMs before 3E was the tendancy to throw "cool monsters" at the players with little regard for difficulty. Nothing like walking by a table and hearing that the players are being attacked by trolls, only to find the highest level character is 2nd level (well, was second level).

 

[Psychic Warrior]

I find the CR/EL system to be extremely useful for me. While it is not 100% accurate it does beat the random guessing I used to do in previous editions.

Funny this should come up as just yesterday I had my PCs face an encounter in my Age of Worms game that I thought would be a moderately easy challenge. They are all 12th level and there are 6 of them. The party is pretty heavy hitting and wade through most encounters with equal ELs (I guage them at EL 13 since there are 50% more of them over the standard 4) but one EL 12 encounter nearly wiped out the whole party! It was the Ice Golems from A Gathering of Winds. I added one extra to beef them up slightly (from 2 to 3) but those CR 9 golems knocked out 2 party members and had 2 others in single digit hit point land! I was stunned at the problems they had with what was supposed to be a slightly below average difficulty encounter. One of the players, after I had told him what the EL was, was shocked as he was convinced the party was "fighting above it's weight class' given the difficulty of the fight. On paper those Ice Golems seemed pretty weak but they certainly put the fear of death into my group!

 

[Dragonbait]

I've found that my players can easily beat thing that are a higher CR than they are, but that's not a fault of the CR system. Instead it's because I'm not the best tactician; after all, they have 4 brains versus my one brain.

repeated because I feel the same way. Also, they have time to master their 1 PC and know all their abilities, while I have to control umpteen hundred characters.

 

[Grymar]

Another factor to consider with CR is the "encounters per day" concept. In my game it is common for the party to only have one major encounter in a day, rather than a dungeon crawl's 4-6 or better. That throws the CR out of whack because the party has resources at their disposal that they would often have expended. Spells, infusions, /per day items...plus they are always starting combat at full hp.

And if you have a psion in the group, you are in big trouble!

 

[The Shaman]

No, mostly.