Do you play Dragons in lair, right??

[Eremite]

Hey I’m between phone calls here I’m entitled to some misspelling, but thanks for not commenting on any part of the post? just plain sarcasm.

Don't take it that way: I was just having some fun.

As for commenting on your post, well, it's really difficult. Basically, my impression from your posts is that you simply do not know many of the rules and you basically refuse to compensate this by properly preparing before a game. I can only echo other posters and suggest that you start a core-only game at 1st level and go from there.

Also, I think that the reasons you get a lot of sarcastic posts are:

1. Your writing is atrocious in terms of spelling, punctuation, grammar and syntax. That's fine; not everyone is an English Lit grad or similar but it does help contribute to the impression that you're a troll.
2. You come across as a whiner. None of the situations you describe is ever your fault and yet, as the DM, the buck stops with you.
3. You don't seem to put any effort into either your games or your posts rather it seems that you fully expect others to resolve your problems for you. Again, the best advice is that you start your game again and make it core-only. I would also strongly suggest owning the core books if you're going to DM.

 

[Sir ThornCrest]

1)well i didnt want to publish a book but here is a summary the wizard was timing his casting.
2) taking a large amount of damage has always in our campaigns cost you an attack or your move, maybe a penalty to hit or to ac, only the raged or bezerk can bypass this., house rule.
3) the dragon is abnormally susceptable to fire so this amplified his chances of being stunned, I basically played him as being taken back or just taken back...
4) He was under the loose control of the Dread Emperor, so yes he wasnt going to leave, he was going to fight to the death, dragons death anyways.
5) the wizard has a ring its called .....? spell fighting? it basically allows him to know in a 60' what spells are being cast.
6) the dragon caused probably some 250 plus hit pionts to the party from melee, he had gotten off two nacro touch attacks -save or die types-they saved! His spells may have caused about a hundred pionts, take all the energy immunities away a made saves yah they would of died.

thorncrest

OK, Sir T, I'm going to try to be constructive. Reading through your story, I've got a few serious questions.



Why was he stunned? Is this a house rule you have? AFAIK, there's no reason why getting hit by a Fireball, even a big one, will stun a creature. Either (a) he takes fewer HP in damage than he currently has, and he just keeps right on going, or (b) he takes more HP in damage than he currently has, and he dies.



I have no idea why you ruled that he couldn't cast his spells. Taking damage during casting *does* force a Concentration check, but, as far as I can tell from your story, the dragon wasn't actually casting yet when he was hit by the Fireball. By the time it was the dragon's turn, the damage from the Fireball was over and done with. It should have had *no impact* on the dragon's ability to cast his spells.



Same issue. I think you're misunderstanding what forces a Concentration check. Only damage taken *while the caster is actually casting the spell* forces a Concentration check. It doesn't matter if he's taken a zillion HP of damage earlier in the round; as long as nothing's pestering him *during his action*, he won't have an issue with casting a spell.

And, again, you talk about the dragon being "stunned" and "staggered" -- by what, exactly? Simply taking HP of damage doesn't do that, by the rules. To stun or stagger a creature, you need to hit them with an effect that specifically states it does this.

To sum up: why was this dragon a pushover?
- Yes, your players used some weapons and spells that were particularly effective.
- It looks to me like you've got some sort of house rule about being stunned after taking lots of damage, which seriously nerfed the dragon.
- It also looks like you were making him make Concentration checks to cast his spells, when he didn't need to.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Another mistake: You screwed up on Brilliant Energy. Read it again, it only cuts through nonliving material like Armour, but not natural armour.

Oh, and I play a lot at very-high and epic levels without a problem, so I thought I'd add a bit of advice:

You will have serious problems if you start a campaign with noncore material at such a high level. I allow noncore material, and plenty of it, but I also started my campaign at level 1. This let me get a feel for the characters, and this is something absolutely crucial. Every group at this level is different, and CR means nothing. Only a DM who has that intimate of knowledge of the PCs can truly design good challenges for them (and it has the added benefit of not just giving the PCs Saint for free, but that's just a side-note).

 

[BSF]

Huh, I just noticed. Do you guys roll initiative every round?

Having a house rule that penalizes you for taking large damage hits is going to severely cripple creatures like dragons. They use those HP to have any chance of withstanding the full brunt of an attack by an entire party. With that type of house ruling, you are better off using several smaller opponents that can get off solid hits. Expect to see this problem exacerbated as the campaign grows in levels. Single big opponents might be able to daze one PC, but the rest of the PCs willl more than make up for this.

 

[Sir ThornCrest]

the dragons touch ac was I think a 13? In human form the dragon/demon had +3 DEMON PLATE

Another mistake: You screwed up on Brilliant Energy. Read it again, it only cuts through nonliving material like Armour, but not natural armour.

Oh, and I play a lot at very-high and epic levels without a problem, so I thought I'd add a bit of advice:

You will have serious problems if you start a campaign with noncore material at such a high level. I allow noncore material, and plenty of it, but I also started my campaign at level 1. This let me get a feel for the characters, and this is something absolutely crucial. Every group at this level is different, and CR means nothing. Only a DM who has that intimate of knowledge of the PCs can truly design good challenges for them (and it has the added benefit of not just giving the PCs Saint for free, but that's just a side-note).

 

[Sir ThornCrest]

YES

QUOTE=BardStephenFox]Huh, I just noticed. Do you guys roll initiative every round?

Having a house rule that penalizes you for taking large damage hits is going to severely cripple creatures like dragons. They use those HP to have any chance of withstanding the full brunt of an attack by an entire party. With that type of house ruling, you are better off using several smaller opponents that can get off solid hits. Expect to see this problem exacerbated as the campaign grows in levels. Single big opponents might be able to daze one PC, but the rest of the PCs willl more than make up for this.[/QUOTE]

 

[Rystil Arden]

I thought I'd clarify on my "CR means nothing" comment:

I have 3 PCs, a Frenzied Berserker (ECL 18, as he dies a lot), an Azer Cleric (ECL 19), and a Nymph Archmage (ECL 20). They also have NPC friends and cohorts that they sometimes bring along.

They defeated large numbers of CR 28 encounters, some much harder than others. Then the PCs came up against one ECL 14, CR 13 NPC. To this battle, they bring the following allies: the PCs, juvenile silver dragon cohort, ECL 21 human psion, ECL 22 alu-fiend cleric, ECL 27! moon-elf archmage, ECL 22 star-elf Mystic Theurge, ECL 24 human archmage, ECL 22 human archmage, ECL 14 wild-elf shaman, ECL 18 pixie ninja cohort.

Guess what? Every last one of the PCs and their allies died except the azer ran away and the Frenzied Berserker managed to finish off the NPC at negative several hundred HP thanks to Deathless Frenzy, then died.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

the dragons touch ac was I think a 13? In human form the dragon/demon had +3 DEMON PLATE

Are you playing 3.0 and tossing in 3.5 material? That could cause a few problems if you don't tweak things around.

 

[Sir ThornCrest]

YES THE DEMON HAD A COUPLE OF FEATS TO AID HIS SPELLCASTING

Originally Posted by spunkrat
Can a Dragon cast spells while silenced?






Actually, a dragon casts spells just like any other sorcerer, verbal components and all. Barring the Silent spell feat or similar ability, Silence stops them just like any other spellcaster.

Spell-like abilities don't use verbal components, and most dragons have at least a few of those, but that's different from their sorcerer spells.

 

[Rystil Arden]

the dragons touch ac was I think a 13? In human form the dragon/demon had +3 DEMON PLATE

Excuse me but you are missing the point here.

Brilliant energy arrows do not make touch attacks. The dragon's touch AC is irrelevant. Brilliant energy removes ARMOUR BONUSES and SHIELD BONUSES. The dragon's natural armour still applies against Brilliant Energy weapons.