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Do you see Fighter players at your own table?
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<blockquote data-quote="Emberashh" data-source="post: 9056286" data-attributes="member: 7040941"><p>And most people do, because playing a Martial is a fundamentally different fantasy that gets satisfied in a fundamentally different way from that of Casters. </p><p></p><p>Its the same underlying reason why a Gish feels different from either one, and why a Paladin, Ranger, or Monk feel different from that. (The common factor being, of course, that they <em>are</em> all different)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, you should just accept that balance isn't everything. Some philosophies, notably the OSR and arguably Classic, explicitly argue that balance is stupid and has no place in the game. </p><p></p><p>And insofar as DND goes, the baseline for where things ought to be vis a vis class design depends on what genre DND is trying to be, and since the days of Appendix N that has always been a mix of sword and sorcery and epic fantasy. The sole things violating this kitbashed genre in 5e are things in Casters that were both deliberately designed to be broken and not incorporated into the level of play they exist at (because they deliberarely didn't design that level of play), and things that were arbitrarily denied to Martials based on the whims of 4chan trolls still pissed off over Weaboo Fightan Magic. </p><p></p><p>Nobody but trolls actually wanted casters to do all the utility heavy lifting, but thats what WOTC took from the Next playtest. </p><p></p><p>But despite all of that, the game is still fun and works, even without extraneous DM effort, as not everybody that plays game takes it that seriously, which is the only means by which you'd start rubbing up against the system.</p><p></p><p>I would argue in fact more people play it closer to its roots as a Dungeon shooter than they do as Critical Roll, and that is why theres a huge disparity in what the online community thinks versus the greater audience.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Emberashh, post: 9056286, member: 7040941"] And most people do, because playing a Martial is a fundamentally different fantasy that gets satisfied in a fundamentally different way from that of Casters. Its the same underlying reason why a Gish feels different from either one, and why a Paladin, Ranger, or Monk feel different from that. (The common factor being, of course, that they [I]are[/I] all different) No, you should just accept that balance isn't everything. Some philosophies, notably the OSR and arguably Classic, explicitly argue that balance is stupid and has no place in the game. And insofar as DND goes, the baseline for where things ought to be vis a vis class design depends on what genre DND is trying to be, and since the days of Appendix N that has always been a mix of sword and sorcery and epic fantasy. The sole things violating this kitbashed genre in 5e are things in Casters that were both deliberately designed to be broken and not incorporated into the level of play they exist at (because they deliberarely didn't design that level of play), and things that were arbitrarily denied to Martials based on the whims of 4chan trolls still pissed off over Weaboo Fightan Magic. Nobody but trolls actually wanted casters to do all the utility heavy lifting, but thats what WOTC took from the Next playtest. But despite all of that, the game is still fun and works, even without extraneous DM effort, as not everybody that plays game takes it that seriously, which is the only means by which you'd start rubbing up against the system. I would argue in fact more people play it closer to its roots as a Dungeon shooter than they do as Critical Roll, and that is why theres a huge disparity in what the online community thinks versus the greater audience. [/QUOTE]
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