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Do you see Fighter players at your own table?
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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9057380" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>How is balance taking precedence over fun and playability by giving martials better options? Are we somehow declaring that casters are neither fun nor playable? Sure, not everyone wants to play a caster, but you don't need to give every martial spellslots and casting to make sure they have powerful, impactful options beyond "I get punched real good" </p><p></p><p>Also, this is a weird bit of slight of hand here. </p><p></p><p>Coffee-lock -> A specific build that works with a specific spell and a specific invocation, and all it really does is mean that a single character doesn't need to sleep. Otherwise has no effect on the game. </p><p></p><p>Sorcadin -> A multi-class between a paladin and a sorcerer. </p><p></p><p>Bladesinger -> A subclass. </p><p></p><p>Now sure, maybe the game doesn't need to be balanced against coffee-locks and Sorcadins... but aren't bladesingers just a single wizard subclass that gets a few martial features? Shouldn't the game be balanced so that a single subclass alone doesn't completely redefine it? I think Bladesingers are fun, but it is really notable that they get so much of the fighter and are so much better than the fighter. To make a perfect Bladesinger all you really need is to take 2 levels of fighter. </p><p></p><p>Oh, also, that 2 level dip is why no multiclasses, I don't think I saw too many people point this out. Since Action Surge let you cast two spells, even if you never wore armor and never used a weapon (and the armor + Defensive fightering style would be good) two levels for action surge and second wind was great. But after that? After that you don't really need anything else from the main fighter class.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 9057380, member: 6801228"] How is balance taking precedence over fun and playability by giving martials better options? Are we somehow declaring that casters are neither fun nor playable? Sure, not everyone wants to play a caster, but you don't need to give every martial spellslots and casting to make sure they have powerful, impactful options beyond "I get punched real good" Also, this is a weird bit of slight of hand here. Coffee-lock -> A specific build that works with a specific spell and a specific invocation, and all it really does is mean that a single character doesn't need to sleep. Otherwise has no effect on the game. Sorcadin -> A multi-class between a paladin and a sorcerer. Bladesinger -> A subclass. Now sure, maybe the game doesn't need to be balanced against coffee-locks and Sorcadins... but aren't bladesingers just a single wizard subclass that gets a few martial features? Shouldn't the game be balanced so that a single subclass alone doesn't completely redefine it? I think Bladesingers are fun, but it is really notable that they get so much of the fighter and are so much better than the fighter. To make a perfect Bladesinger all you really need is to take 2 levels of fighter. Oh, also, that 2 level dip is why no multiclasses, I don't think I saw too many people point this out. Since Action Surge let you cast two spells, even if you never wore armor and never used a weapon (and the armor + Defensive fightering style would be good) two levels for action surge and second wind was great. But after that? After that you don't really need anything else from the main fighter class. [/QUOTE]
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