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Doctors & Daleks - Cubicle 7 Brings Doctor Who to D&D 5E
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<blockquote data-quote="Bacon Bits" data-source="post: 8554988" data-attributes="member: 6777737"><p>I'm not sure I follow that logic. If non-casters stop scaling, but casters go epic, why does that mean the game is epic? We haven't done anything to make non-casters epic.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I just think it's redundant with Rary's telepathic bond (5th).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Glibness isn't much better than enhance ability (eagle's splendor). Not such that it demands it's own spell to overcome the limitations of enhance ability.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Word of Recall, Wind Walk, Tree Stride, Summon Steed, Transport via Plants, etc. There are so many spells already that enhance travel speeds. The game doesn't really benefit that much from a super power like Teleport existing.</p><p></p><p>There are so many spells that just boggle my mind for why they exist. Speak with dead? Zone of truth? Find the path? True seeing (for an hour without concentration)? Knock? If this is a game about going on adventures and telling stories and overcoming challenges, what kind of stories are you going to tell with these effects if you can overcome so many standard narrative obstacles with spells? It's just <em>weird</em>. It's like they're a walking deus ex machina. "I just cast a spell that unloads Chekhov's gun."</p><p></p><p>It feels like they just dumped in all the spells that people remember without thinking what role that spell was supposed to play in the game. Especially compared to how PCs that <em>don't</em> have those effects have to overcome them. When you get to 7th and higher level spells, it's really clear that at no point did make these pretty simple design considerations.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sure, but the trouble with that is that it's 100% up to the DM. The PCs -- all PCs above some arbitrary level -- need to be able to have enough control to be able to traverse the planes at the <em>player's</em> choice, not just because the DM decides the story should go that way. But the way the game is written, you <em>must</em> have a wizard or cleric to do that. If a party of fighters wants to find a long dead monarch, they have travel to the afterlife to talk to them. But a wizard or a cleric makes that even easier, too.</p><p></p><p>I'm not saying that wizards and clerics can't have spells that do things fighters can't. But if the game can be about travelling the planes -- and I think that at high level it should be -- then the game shouldn't <em>de facto</em> require certain classes to accomplish that and should otherwise be DM fiat. If a high level fighter wants to rescue his true love from the pits of Gehenna, then it shouldn't be <em>orders of magnitude</em> more complicated for them to do it than a spellcaster. And the solution shouldn't be "find a spellcaster".</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Bacon Bits, post: 8554988, member: 6777737"] I'm not sure I follow that logic. If non-casters stop scaling, but casters go epic, why does that mean the game is epic? We haven't done anything to make non-casters epic. I just think it's redundant with Rary's telepathic bond (5th). Glibness isn't much better than enhance ability (eagle's splendor). Not such that it demands it's own spell to overcome the limitations of enhance ability. Word of Recall, Wind Walk, Tree Stride, Summon Steed, Transport via Plants, etc. There are so many spells already that enhance travel speeds. The game doesn't really benefit that much from a super power like Teleport existing. There are so many spells that just boggle my mind for why they exist. Speak with dead? Zone of truth? Find the path? True seeing (for an hour without concentration)? Knock? If this is a game about going on adventures and telling stories and overcoming challenges, what kind of stories are you going to tell with these effects if you can overcome so many standard narrative obstacles with spells? It's just [I]weird[/I]. It's like they're a walking deus ex machina. "I just cast a spell that unloads Chekhov's gun." It feels like they just dumped in all the spells that people remember without thinking what role that spell was supposed to play in the game. Especially compared to how PCs that [I]don't[/I] have those effects have to overcome them. When you get to 7th and higher level spells, it's really clear that at no point did make these pretty simple design considerations. Sure, but the trouble with that is that it's 100% up to the DM. The PCs -- all PCs above some arbitrary level -- need to be able to have enough control to be able to traverse the planes at the [I]player's[/I] choice, not just because the DM decides the story should go that way. But the way the game is written, you [I]must[/I] have a wizard or cleric to do that. If a party of fighters wants to find a long dead monarch, they have travel to the afterlife to talk to them. But a wizard or a cleric makes that even easier, too. I'm not saying that wizards and clerics can't have spells that do things fighters can't. But if the game can be about travelling the planes -- and I think that at high level it should be -- then the game shouldn't [I]de facto[/I] require certain classes to accomplish that and should otherwise be DM fiat. If a high level fighter wants to rescue his true love from the pits of Gehenna, then it shouldn't be [I]orders of magnitude[/I] more complicated for them to do it than a spellcaster. And the solution shouldn't be "find a spellcaster". [/QUOTE]
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Doctors & Daleks - Cubicle 7 Brings Doctor Who to D&D 5E
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