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<blockquote data-quote="Thomas Shey" data-source="post: 9231733" data-attributes="member: 7026617">Though you're not entirely wrong, for some sorts of designs it can still be a virtue.&nbsp; If you normally have a set roll with modifiiers, there's a strong intuitive quality for &quot;I need to roll within this value.&quot;&nbsp; Hero, GURPS and the RQ/BRP school of games have used that for their entire lifespan, and I've seen enough in terms of new players picking that up fast to be pretty firm in considering it a virtue.This is not my disagreeing with the fact the old up-and-down thing with earlier versions of D&amp;D was pretty nonsensical, to be clear.&nbsp; I just have to note that &quot;high is always good&quot; is not entirely true; its a naturalistic to think high is good, but moving target numbers have some overhead flat values with modifiers don't.(You couldn't do this with D&amp;D because of the way armor is baked into attack, but that's not exactly common away from the D&amp;D-adjacent sphere; a lot of the hobby would consider armor modifying to-hit as weird as heck.)</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Thomas Shey, post: 9231733, member: 7026617"] Though you're not entirely wrong, for some sorts of designs it can still be a virtue. If you normally have a set roll with modifiiers, there's a strong intuitive quality for "I need to roll within this value." Hero, GURPS and the RQ/BRP school of games have used that for their entire lifespan, and I've seen enough in terms of new players picking that up fast to be pretty firm in considering it a virtue. This is not my disagreeing with the fact the old up-and-down thing with earlier versions of D&D was pretty nonsensical, to be clear. I just have to note that "high is always good" is not entirely true; its a naturalistic to think high is good, but moving target numbers have some overhead flat values with modifiers don't. (You couldn't do this with D&D because of the way armor is baked into attack, but that's not exactly common away from the D&D-adjacent sphere; a lot of the hobby would consider armor modifying to-hit as weird as heck.) [/QUOTE]

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