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Message: <blockquote data-quote="zago" data-source="post: 6614502" data-attributes="member: 6794539">[MENTION=5890]Saeviomagy[/MENTION]Yikes. I guess I don't understand. Fundamentally the charisma check shouldn't allow someone to convince someone of something they wouldn't do. Advantage on a Charisma check grants a small bonus to what is a 'possible' check. Getting an item for 25-33% off is an example of what I would suggest is a possible check. Getting an item for free isn't.As far as how long it takes: Maybe I spend an hour calmly haggling with a merchant, I say to him this is my last offer and if he doesn't accept right now, I will leave. I cast friends, we contest, I win (let's say) he relents, coin is already on the table, and I walk away a 15g longsword for which I paid only 10g. Now I have about 50 seconds to disappear in a crowd.I don't see this as exceptional at all. I also don't understand how this somehow cracks at the realism of anyone's world.I also don't understand why anyone would look at this cantrip and think, holy cow, this doesn't work and has no use, because every social exchange in my world requires a lot of time. My point about the king is to suggest that their are instances of exceptional 'cons'  in the real world, but a mandate for such power is likely unbalancing in the game world. It would be bad if one skill or ability could grant an exponential wealth gap between players, regardless of whether the concept itself fits with in the paradigm of your world or not. To be what I think is more clear, in a world where Disguise Self exists why wouldn't everyone physically touch someone before they make any deal, allow any entrance, etc... But of course if we insert such 'realism' to the game we greatly inhibit the basic abilities of the players. In the real world, one person with disguise self would be incredibly powerful, on a scale that is difficult to imagine. He could be the head of a state by dinner time. But in D&D it's a first level spell. Don't ask yourself if Friends 'Works' in your world, ask yourself how your world can work such that friends is a cantrip commensurate power as other cantrips.</blockquote>

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