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Dragonscale Armor/Cloaks/Shields?

Zarithar

Adventurer
The party in the campaign I am DMing recently killed a young purple dragon and are interested in selling the hide and/or having it made into armor/shield covering/cloak/etc.

Unfortunately, the first Draconomicon (I don't own the second) does not go into any detail regarding dragonscale.

I was thinking for a purple dragon a skilled smith/tanner could perhaps make a suit of +2 scale mail with say... resist 5 psychic (purple dragon). I am somewhat at a loss for a daily power, though I was thinking along the lines of some form of domination lasting perhaps 1 round for example.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Also... I seem to recall that dragon's teeth in past editions had magical properties. The Draconomicon covers only things like blood, organs, etc for use in alchemy. Again, advice would be appreciated!

Thank you.
 

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sigfile

Explorer
I'd allow the hide to be used as a major component for the enchant item ritual to create Nightmare Ward armor.

Resist: 5 psychic
Property: +2 to saving throws against charm, fear, and psychic effects
 

keterys

First Post
Personally, I don't particularly recommend instilling a belief that hacking apart corpses leads to more treasure... but eh :) If you'd planned on it counting for treasure, then sure, great. Getting extra treasure parcels through bloodymindedness, less so.

A young purple is a level 6 solo, so I'd probably look for an item in the level 6-ish range. Say +2 Dragonrider's or +2 Resistance (Psychic). Nightmare is a good pick too, as mentioned. If you want, a couple of the teeth functioning as consumables for Potion of Resistance (Psychic) or Dragonbreath (Psychic) could work.
 

Klaus

First Post
The party in the campaign I am DMing recently killed a young purple dragon and are interested in selling the hide and/or having it made into armor/shield covering/cloak/etc.

Unfortunately, the first Draconomicon (I don't own the second) does not go into any detail regarding dragonscale.

I was thinking for a purple dragon a skilled smith/tanner could perhaps make a suit of +2 scale mail with say... resist 5 psychic (purple dragon). I am somewhat at a loss for a daily power, though I was thinking along the lines of some form of domination lasting perhaps 1 round for example.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Also... I seem to recall that dragon's teeth in past editions had magical properties. The Draconomicon covers only things like blood, organs, etc for use in alchemy. Again, advice would be appreciated!

Thank you.
There are no specific rules for dragonscale items. Just choose (or let the players choose) the armor/cloak/shield they want, and let them create it from the dragon's hide. You then remove the appropriate items from future treasure hoards.

As mentioned above, limit the items' levels to the dragon's level or thereabouts (yielding level 6, 7 or 8 items).
 

Shin Okada

Explorer
Maybe you would better check Item Components rule in DMG II, chapter 5.

You can make some or all of the purple dragon's body as item components to create some magic items in players' wish list.
 

jbear

First Post
Personally, I don't particularly recommend instilling a belief that hacking apart corpses leads to more treasure... but eh :) If you'd planned on it counting for treasure, then sure, great. Getting extra treasure parcels through bloodymindedness, less so.

A young purple is a level 6 solo, so I'd probably look for an item in the level 6-ish range. Say +2 Dragonrider's or +2 Resistance (Psychic). Nightmare is a good pick too, as mentioned. If you want, a couple of the teeth functioning as consumables for Potion of Resistance (Psychic) or Dragonbreath (Psychic) could work.
You really consider skinning a dragon bloody minded oO''? Shucks, I must be bloody minded too then. I woudn't skin an orc and wear him, that'd be gross, but a dragon... If I live and it dies, that thing is boots!!!!
 

Mithreinmaethor

First Post
Unfortunately there is no basis by which to do what the OP was requesting.

The rules in the DMG2 are the closest you will get.

Otherwise a dragons hide is just like any other hide. Its made into either normal leather or normal hide armor.
 

Dr_Ruminahui

First Post
Well, there are rules in the Draconomicon which might be closer - there are rules in it specifically about cutting up dragons and using their gribblies for whatnots.
 

LightPhoenix

First Post
I'd recommend using it as a plot hook. Let the PCs make the armor, but have to quest to find someone who can work it. Make the PCs the target of another purple dragon, or mercenaries working for them. It's a valuable item, maybe thieves are gunning to get the PCs. One of my players wanted to make a cap, so (spoiler just in case)
it's an intelligent item with the spirit of the slain dragon in it
.

The absolute worst thing you could do would be to not take advantage of it, or squander it on simple mechanics.
 

the-golem

Explorer
Unfortunately there is no basis by which to do what the OP was requesting.

The rules in the DMG2 are the closest you will get.

Otherwise a dragons hide is just like any other hide. Its made into either normal leather or normal hide armor.

While there aren't hard rules on the subject, I'd rule that the dragonscale and the dragonhide are two seperate things. A dragons scales attach to its skin much like feathers attach to a chicken (Or hair to a human, for that matter). It's fully possible to de-scale a dragon and use its scales for Wyrmscale Armor, or somesuch, and use it's hide/skin for another armor is perfectly fine to me.

IMHO, A dragons scales are equal in strength/composition to steel scale armor.
 

MarkB

Legend
Not having the DMGII, I don't know if I'm duplicating the Item Components concept here, but I'd suggest assigning an appropriate treasure-parcel value to the useful items that can be harvested from the dragon, and then treating them as specialised ritual components which can only be used with item-creation rituals, including Enchant Magic Item, Transfer Enchantment and Brew Potion.

The components can be sold to merchants only for 20% value, but count as 100% value when provided for one of these rituals.

That way, you can characterise their usage in magic items however you want to. If they're being used in the creation or enhancement of magic armour, the ritual caster is incorporating the scales or hide into the armour to grant it extra resilience. If making a weapon more powerful, the blade is being reforged with dragon's blood alloyed into its metal. If brewing potions, certain of the dragon's organs or bodily fluids are being boiled up and incorporated into the recipe to give it added potency.

The results, game-mechanically, are exactly the same as if you'd used normal ritual components, but aesthetically, these items now incorporate aspects of the dragon used to create them.
 

keterys

First Post
You really consider skinning a dragon bloody minded oO''? Shucks, I must be bloody minded too then. I woudn't skin an orc and wear him, that'd be gross, but a dragon... If I live and it dies, that thing is boots!!!!

Do you expect to get extra treasure for it? How about skinning a troll for its hide, since it regenerates? Basilisk horn for a weapon, or to make consumables. Griffon feathers for flight. Macetail behemoth tail. Beholder eyes for wands. Etc.

If you're not getting extra treasure as a result, great. I'm all for using them for cool looking clothes, decorate your appearance, etc.
 

Larrin

Entropic Good
Who doesn't want to skin a dragon for its scales? Seriously, its in most adventurers blood.

My suggestion for something fun to do with it: Let them enchant any hide or scale armor type...boost the level by 1 (thus the cost of enchanting) and add in damage resist 5 or 10 of the appropriate type, maybe a daily that boosts the resist to 20 for an attack if the dragon was fairly old. That way dragon scales are special, usable, not over powered, and simple.

example:simple +1 purple dragon scale armor would be lvl2, and give resist psychic 5.
+3 purple dragon scale might still be resist 5, but have a daily im.interrupt: gain resist 15 vs one attack.

play around with that idea, i would.
 

Marauder_POV

First Post
the problems i have with scale/dragon scale is that dragon scale should be lighter, and as such not have the skill check penalty.

I've had a bit of a look and there arn't to many options for chars that don't want to loose that bit of skill, just for the extra AC.(other than the very high level leathers and the "Eladrin" suffix which is really crap)
 

jbear

First Post
Do you expect to get extra treasure for it? How about skinning a troll for its hide, since it regenerates? Basilisk horn for a weapon, or to make consumables. Griffon feathers for flight. Macetail behemoth tail. Beholder eyes for wands. Etc.

If you're not getting extra treasure as a result, great. I'm all for using them for cool looking clothes, decorate your appearance, etc.
Nah, I just want a pair of purple dragon boots to wear out to the tavern between adventures. Disco!
 

MarkB

Legend
the problems i have with scale/dragon scale is that dragon scale should be lighter, and as such not have the skill check penalty.

Whyso? Dragon scales may (or quite possibly may not) be lighter than an equivalent sized piece of steel, but the steel can be worked into the perfect shape and size for a set of armour, whereas with dragon scales the armourer must work with the scales as they are, even if they're not quite the right size or shape for the job. They might well be thicker and bulkier than would be ideal for a set of armour. And that's before even considering methods of attachment for natural as opposed to manufactured materials.

If anything, the dragonscale, whilst not necessarily heavier, should be less supple and a less perfect fit, making it awkward to work in.
 

AndrewDB

First Post
I believe one of the Dragon books has fluff about creating dragon items. Note that I said fluff, not rules. Since dragons have strong ties to elemental forces, their body parts quickly deteriorate into their elemental components. The body parts deteriorate too much to use in crafting items. So said the fluff.

I remember this mostly because the fluff seemed contrary to prior treatments of dragon scale armor and dragon bone weapons in previous versions of the game. This seems intentional on the part of the designers though. It seems they do not want to turn dragon corpses into giant treasure parcels.

The fluff seems to have enough wiggle room for players who have an absolute need to make dragon armor though. I would rule that a player needs to pass a skill challenge in order to harvest the components successfully. I would treat the components as standard magical components, then make the value of the components equal to the appropriate reward for the skill challenge.
 

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