[Dragonstar] Skills Question: Use Device vs. Computers/Electronics

[Eye Tyrant]

For those that also own the Spycraft book, I was looking at how Computer/Electronic hacking and what-not works in Spycraft and I think that I like the set up better then that presented in the SFHB. My question: Has anyone played using these and which one works best?

To me Use Device seems very vague and open to interpretaion. Basically anyone with a decent Use Device score can hack computers, program them as well, operate misc. electronic gear etc... The same holds true for Repair. These skills listed in the SFHB allow for a broad range of tasks to be attempted for a relatively low skill point cost.

I am thinking of breaking down the skills Use Device and Repair into Computers, Electronics, and Mechanics. Someone might be able to Repair a transmission but not a Datapad... I have also thought of breaking it into Knowledge skills (ie. Knowledge: Computer Programming). This makes sense, right?

Thoughts, ideas?

 

[jonrog1]

I'm a Spycraft junkie, but I actually slightly prefer the skill list form D20Modern, which is free as the SRD.

I'd say use the Computer Use rules from Spycraft (I combine them with the D20Modern, but no need), the Repair, Craft (electronics) and Disable Device (which is according to what kit you're using) from D20Modern. IMHO that's a good definition of skills by intent: somebody good at repairing Computers isn't necessarily a great hacker, but neither might be all that good at circumventing electronic security. Use Device kind of lumps all those together, this is a good split.

 

[Eye Tyrant]

Those are basically my thoughts as well. D20 Modern has never REALLY appealled to me. I took a look at the generic classes and never looked again, but I digress... I am looking for a grittiness to add to this element of the game, and I think I am going to go with the Spycraft skills Computers, Electronics, Mechanics, Surveillance,Sleight of Hand, Demolitions, and perhaps use the Cryptography and Bureacracy.

 

[jonrog1]

Interesting, you've brought up my one -- and only one -- problem with Spycraft: too many skills. What does bureacracy do that a diplomacy or bluff check can't?

And surveillance -- covered by spot, listen, search, or Investigate, which is a lovely catch-all skill.

I'd allow Decipher Script to be switched in and out at will with Cryptography, the mechanic's basically the same. I think the Demolitions skill in D20Modern's actually a little cleaner than the Spycraft version.

Have fun.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Splitting (or nonspliting skill) skills can be made even worse - see Shadowrun or D20 Farscape (Negotiate vs Diplomacy? Where the heck is the difference, besides the DC table?)

But here is what I do (in Dragonstar):
Use Device is for operating machines (and sensors) and programming simple tasks, like "if A happens, open gate 2, if B happens, activate self defense system, if C happens start vacuum cleaner".
Cryptography is coding or decoding messages.
Repair is any kind of Repair or making more or less minor modifications (like playing Scotty and making the Warp Drive faster and so on )
Disable Device is the opposite of Repair - damage/destroy something.

If someone wants to programm a very complex programm (a new operating system, the AI of a combat drone and so on), he has to use the Craft (Software) Skill. If he wants to build a new PC or create a new roboter, he uses the Craft (Electronics) skill, or since this is somehow specific the Craft (Robots) skill (which would probably mean lower DCs compared to Electronics)

Mustrum Ridcully

 

[Eye Tyrant]

All very good/valid points. I agree with the Diplomacy/Buraecracy type skills being one and the same. I still think that Repair is too all-encompassing, but I like the Craft skills as Mustrum explained. What I like about the Spycraft skills Computers, Electronics, and Mechanics is that they cover the use and repair of the relevant equipment. I don't own D20 Modern or have the SRD link... so I can't check out the Demolitions in that source. If anyone can post a link or give me some instruction I would be grateful... Is the SRD that bit that was in Dragon magazine some months ago?

 

[jonrog1]

TheSRD is the system of rules which is Open Game Content, and so can freely be used in other game systems as long as the copyright is acknowledged. Note I said "freely" -- essentially the entire game except for flavor text and settings can be had for literally nothing.

Access to the SRD can be had off multiple links in the D20Modern Forum right here on these boards. Just look one forum down from this one.