Druids are not Hippies!

[Kuld]

Druids arent treehuggers, ELF druids are.

Dern Elves.

There is a good recent book about this sort of thing: Collapse, by Jared Diamond (professor of Geography at UCLA, IIRC). It's not as masterly as his Guns, Germs, and Steel, but more relevant to this issue.

In the more specialised area of the effect of ['pre' civilised] hunter-gatherers on the environment in Australila, there is Tim Flannery's The Future Eaters.

Brief summary: even stone-age populations, hunter-gatherers and primitive horticulturalists, can destroy a landscape in surprisingly short time.

I read a book about ancient Celtic civilizations a while ago and I remember the author saying that Britain was once a lush forest, however not much, if at all, has changed to the landscape in thousands of years.
The civilization (possibly pre-Celtic (Indo-European)) that was there made it look almost exactly as it does today, which means deforestation took place a long time ago. I will try to find the books title again (It was a library check-out)

 

[Pielorinho]

There were conservation inititives in the Middle Ages once they realized that they really needed wood and they were cutting down a aweful lot of it.

Thanks, Joe--very cool post!

On the one hand, I agree that the "humans suck!" approach to druids does not have any societal precedent in the real world. Every culture out there has had a way to interact with nature, has altered nature.

You know those New England Native American tribes who lived lightly off the land as wandering hunter-gatherers? Those big forests they lived in were of their own creation, through judicious use of fire and other tools (I was looking for my copy of Changes in the Land, an ecological historian's account of how Native Americans and early European settlers altered the New England landscape, but I'm unable to find it). Everyone changes their environment.

On the other hand, in a world with factual and highly communicative Gods, it's not out of the question that nature gods want to protect and expand their own territory. Yes, the sentient races are a part of nature; however, the sentient races in D&D and the real world tend to alter their habitats more profoundly and more rapidly than the nonsentient critters do. A nature god who wants to protect her domain isn't going to like that rapid alteration, and may develop an antipathy toward humanoids.

My own druid is patterned off the doctor in Deadwood: a profane, frustrated, low-charisma, highly-ethical guy who doesn't much like people and thinks they're horrible but tries to do the right thing anyway. He's no hippie: he kills prisoners, he issues deadly threats, and he's not above eating a deceased animal companion because hey, why waste food? But he's also working on developing mining techniques that don't offend his deity, and refuses to help a party-member mine an incredibly valuable vein of mithral that we ran across. He hates cities (except for the food), prefers to sleep outside away from the smells of civilization whenever possible. He carries a Quench scroll around in case he ends up having to cast a Firestorm in the middle of a forest.

I think that with druids as with any other class, it's important to have a good strong background for the roleplaying.

Daniel

 

[just__al]

Jut becaue it is not a historical sim doesn't mean modern sensibilities fit the milieu. I just don't think the faddish, politically correct kind of eco-love that makes us feel all warm and fuzzy inside for recycling our newspapers fits in adventure fantasy. I mean, does the stereotypical 1980s Wall Street Shark have a place in a Star Trek federation game. (Someone is *so* going to answer 'yes'...)

There was that episode of TNG where the 80s wallstreet shark was found criogenically frozen in space and they revived him. He was quite interesting as a strong willed hard as nails (mentally) person who was thrown into a situation where his entire outlook and worldview doesn't apply.

 

[lukelightning]

Ah, yes, a vehicle with the half-electric template applied to it.

Hummers pollute the air. A druid should drive a hybrid.

 

[Agback]

Here's a good read: Multi-Use Management of the Medieval Anglo-Norman Forest.

That is a good read. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

[Pielorinho]

A question: while culturally integrated druids aren't likely to be anti-human, is there historical precedent for misanthropic natureloving hermits? Could a druid fit this mold comfortably?

Daniel

 

[Rackhir]

There was that episode of TNG where the 80s wallstreet shark was found criogenically frozen in space and they revived him. He was quite interesting as a strong willed hard as nails (mentally) person who was thrown into a situation where his entire outlook and worldview doesn't apply.

I think he was actually from the 21's century or something like that, but the episode did air in the '80s. I remember that episode because at one point Picard was chewing him out and telling him that even the youngest child on the ship was more responsible than he was. In the very next episode, a kid got upset over something stole a shuttle and nearly crashed it. So much for everyone in the 24th century being perfect.

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

See, now I would say he'd be playing a perfectly good druid unless he was intentionally shafting the party. He could still go into cities but would make comments all the time about what a bad idea it was to crowd so many people together. I'd think the 'not sleeping in buildings' thing would be great RPing. Sleeping on the roof, or sleeping in his wildshape out on the back porch, or just out in the stable with a bunch of dogs and a couple cats to keep him warm.

I suppose. The player is my friend, funny guy, but this is the same fellow who played a kender for the soul purpose of stealing from the party and being a nuisance. I can't speak for our GM, but I think he likes to run games with a more serious bent, and his concepts generally don't fit that mold.

I could argue that it doesn't make sense to isolate yourself when your party is being stalked by slavers. You could argue that beliefs don't necessarily make sense. It's moot either way because I think the primary reason for the "roleplaying" was to muck things up.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Even if D&D were a historical simulation, which it clearly isn't, our games would abound with modern concepts. It's simply impossible for us to step outside our worldview. This is true of historians too. I feel the recent view of the population collapse in Easter Island as eco-parable rather than race war is a good example of our inability to see the past through anything other than our modern perspective.

That being the case I have no problem with fantasy worlds full of environmentalism, religious fundamentalists and girl power. These ideas are far more important to us than feudalism and crop rotation.


PS When you consider the period in which D&D was created, it's pretty clear druids *are* hippies.

 

[Rackhir]

I feel the recent view of the population collapse in Easter Island as eco-parable rather than race war is a good example of our inability to see the past through anything other than our modern perspective.

Er Race War? Who were they fighting? They were all one ethnic group on the island.