DTRPG Says 'Don't criticize us or we'll ban you'

[aramis erak]

I like that it does that though. Do you?

not really. I like my parody silly in tone and engaging in wordplay...
Spaceballs. Galaxy Quest. Robin Hood: Men in Tights. Monte Python and the Holy Grail (Movie and stage). Monte Python's Life of Brian. Star Trek Discovery¹.

Every new book I buy that has to specify what's "bad" and/or instructs me the "moral" way to play the game puts me off.

Rifts hits the same mindset space for me as TORG, and I prefer TORG's mechanics to Rifts'. I also prefer TORG's setup for the genre mix-n-match.

Midwesterner humor can be sort of dry (and weird), Siembieda is from Detroit, Michigan; so like Chicago, is even more of somewhere to poke fun at. Chi-town is even regular slang for the place, it is all sort of a gonzo parody, played straight, if that makes sense, sort of like the Yoopers being the last bastion of civilization.

Most of my dad's family are in greater Detroit Metro... which is 100+ distinct communities in search of a common identity....
Many of my wife's family, as well. Making blanket statements about Detroit having a uniform ANYTHING is problematic.

I agree, however, that Rifts is intended as parody. But it's not labeled as such, and given its serious tone, that it's parody is a thing the Siembieda would have been better mentioning in the disclaimer.

t's very easy to look at the Rifts Corebook and miss that it's parody. Several of my former students have....

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1: Yes, I'm accusing ST Discovery of being a Star Trek Parody, not real Trek. Even if I do enjoy it. Orville and Strange New Worlds are both better Trek, IMO.

 

[dragoner]

As someone from Michigan, can you explain this a bit? I'm not as familiar with Rifts, so I'm confused by what this actually references.

In game setting. Chicago is the big and horrible empire, and the upper peninsula is the last bastion of civilization.

 

[Mannahnin]

I agree, however, that Rifts is intended as parody. But it's not labeled as such, and given its serious tone, that it's parody is a thing the Siembieda would have been better mentioning in the disclaimer.

t's very easy to look at the Rifts Corebook and miss that it's parody. Several of my former students have....

I definitely think the parodic element is left pretty dry, but the core book certainly presents the Coalition primarily as villains, rather than the most likely faction players will be from. Even though multiple Coalition character classes are offered as options.

 

[aramis erak]

I definitely think the parodic element is left pretty dry, but the core book certainly presents the Coalition primarily as villains, rather than the most likely faction players will be from. Even though multiple Coalition character classes are offered as options.

It provides nowhere else to be from in the core. The coalition OCCs are pretty much the Coalition military; the rest in the core are pretty much everyone else in the CS.

 

[Mannahnin]

It provides nowhere else to be from in the core. The coalition OCCs are pretty much the Coalition military; the rest in the core are pretty much everyone else in the CS.

Not Tolkeen, Lazlo, the Federation of Magic or Lone Star? The CS is definitely offered as an option (and given the most detail, as I recall) but if you set your game there, they're still expected to be bad guys, like the Empire in Star Wars. But there are also other places they don't control where you can set your game.

 

[Justice and Rule]

In game setting. Chicago is the big and horrible empire, and the upper peninsula is the last bastion of civilization.

That's fine and I caught that. Just... what's parodic about it? Like, I'm from the area and don't see it actually mocking or making fun of something. That just seems to be reference, which is fine.

I suppose what I'm saying is that I don't really see a joke: a fascist empire from Chicago doesn't really strike anything to me other than "Hey, I've been there before", but it's not really making a point or a joke in it unless there's something deeper in the text that people haven't mentioned yet. Rifts to me has never really come off as a parody as much as a kitchen-sink setting with a bit of 80's edginess to it.

 

[dragoner]

That's fine and I caught that. Just... what's parodic about it? Like, I'm from the area and don't see it actually mocking or making fun of something. That just seems to be reference, which is fine.

I suppose what I'm saying is that I don't really see a joke: a fascist empire from Chicago doesn't really strike anything to me other than "Hey, I've been there before", but it's not really making a point or a joke in it unless there's something deeper in the text that people haven't mentioned yet. Rifts to me has never really come off as a parody as much as a kitchen-sink setting with a bit of 80's edginess to it.

No exaggeration, nothing comedic?

 

[Cordwainer Fish]

No exaggeration, nothing comedic?

It might be comedic if the emperor was a lich-ified Richard J. Daley. Might.

 

[Justice and Rule]

No exaggeration, nothing comedic?

What's the exaggeration of? Like, just having the UP be a staging post for civilization isn't necessarily a joke, nor having an ultra-fascist Chicago. LHonestly, there's nothing really comedic about those things in those places, and I say this as a guy from the area where KS is from.

It might be comedic if the emperor was a lich-ified Richard J. Daley. Might.

Make it so that Chicago is an undead democracy, and we have something of a joke!

 

[dragoner]

It might be comedic if the emperor was a lich-ified Richard J. Daley. Might.

Why is that?

 

[dragoner]

What's the exaggeration of? Like, just having the UP be a staging post for civilization isn't necessarily a joke, nor having an ultra-fascist Chicago. LHonestly, there's nothing really comedic about those things in those places, and I say this as a guy from the area where KS is from.



Make it so that Chicago is an undead democracy, and we have something of a joke!

What's it not an exaggeration of? Chicago totally has Dead boy armored troops in flying skull carriers, right? 100% completely normal. Same as the UP being a bastion of civilization.

 

[Deset Gled]

What's the exaggeration of? Like, just having the UP be a staging post for civilization isn't necessarily a joke,

I'm not familiar with the Palladium lore, but I've spent time in the UP. I even met Hoolie once. I can see the joke.

 

[dragoner]

I live just south of Chicago, I think there is some sort of subtext going on.

 

[Justice and Rule]

What's it not an exaggeration of? Chicago totally has Dead boy armored troops in flying skull carriers, right? 100% completely normal.

Just having wild stuff doesn't make it a parody. There has to be a joke there. What you are describing isn't a joke, it's an aesthetic. An exaggerated one, a pastiche, but just that, and not one that has anything to really do with Chicago. There's nothing necessarily being made fun of, especially given that the skull-o-mania aesthetic can be done unironically: just look at 40K, which may have started out using that aesthetic ironically but over time morphed into using it rather unironically.

Same as the UP being a bastion of civilization.

Just making a place that is rural and backwoods into a thriving industrial power doesn't necessarily mean it's a parody, unless they are actually making fun of the area. Like, do they have a pasty on their flag or something, because from what I can find I don't think it's actually making fun of it.

To give an example, OCP in the Robocop series is a parody of corporate culture, but you can't just have an evil corporation that only cares about the bottom line and nothing else; there's no parody in that. It becomes a parody when you have the CEO looking down from a balcony on his new crack-powered police robot with the brain of a druglord massacring innocent civilians and cops and his only response it to calmly say "This could look bad for OCP, Johnson. Scramble the best spin team we have."

This whole thing started with the idea that "Midwestern humor is really dry" and I went "No, I grew up a drive down 696 and a turn onto 275 away from KS and I don't really see any unique Michigan humor here". If you wanted something like that, he'd make a magical healing elixir with a ginger taste that cures all minor aliments.

That's not to say Rifts has no parody, but I just don't see it here and I don't think it's because it's some sort of regional humor thing.

 

[dragoner]

Parody being exaggeration for comedic intent, definitely Chi-town and the UP are, it is just done in a dry style. Parody doesn't mean it has to be slapstick, or silly. WH40K is definitely a parody.

 

[Justice and Rule]

Parody being exaggeration for comedic intent, definitely Chi-town and the UP are, it is just done in a dry style. Parody doesn't mean it has to be slapstick, or silly. WH40K is definitely a parody.

I mean, yes and no. So exaggeration can be parody, but it has to have something to it. 40K can be parody, but it can also be completely straight-faced (and was for quite a while). In particular, the skull aesthetic became less parody and more a stylistic choice given how the Imperium and its story became more of a serious thing. You need something more there to make it a joke beyond the aesthetic because skull stuff might not work as a joke on its own. To me, when I look at Rifts, all the skull stuff comes off more 1970's-1980's heavy metal-esque stuff.

I suppose my bigger point is that as someone from the area, I don't see those things as particularly parodic. Maybe the UP is, but I just find it kind of a very lame joke (especially when we in the right hand can probably make some better ones about those in the left hand). With the Coalition, I don't see anything that really relates to Chicago beyond calling it Chi-town. Like, I do find stuff like this funny:

But I don't think that's really "dry" as it's just ridiculous (and great, as someone who isn't a fan of Rifts). But outside some stuff like this, I don't think the Coalition and them as fascists are really meant to be a joke. I just thought they were meant to be the villain faction of the setting.

Also huge missed opportunity to not call the Lower Peninsula "Troll Country".

 

[Cordwainer Fish]

Also huge missed opportunity to not call the Lower Peninsula "Troll Country".

I understood that reference.

 

[Crusadius]

I don't think the Coalition/Chi-Town is a parody. But I do think it might be a homage to movies like Mad Max with a post apocalypse setting and the villain runs a town. Instead of half-naked bikies who haven't had a bath in years you have armored soldiers wearing skull helmets riding/flying vehicles with skulls.

 

[Justice and Rule]

I don't think the Coalition/Chi-Town is a parody. But I do think it might be a homage to movies like Mad Max with a post apocalypse setting and the villain runs a town. Instead of half-naked bikies who haven't had a bath in years you have armored soldiers wearing skull helmets riding/flying vehicles with skulls.

I figured general fascist imagery along with healthy doses of heavy metal skull/2000 AD/Terminator inspirations.

 

[aramis erak]

Not sure if already posted, but James Raggi's response.

Figured it was worth posting since his work is both popular and likely to be affected by the new policy.

He's the third name that comes to mind on "likely to be affected"...
RIght after Zac and RPG Pundit.

Why do these guys always insist on doing videos shirtless?

Quite possibly due to temperatures and not being able to afford A/C...
To be honest, makes me think "Ted Nugent"...
Heck, one of my 3 videos on Youtube was done shirtless... but you only see my hands, so it's irrelevant. It was quite warm when I shot it.