Dwarven Traits (Wording)

[doktorstick]

Howdy. First, this isn't a meaty post, but its contents has been bugging me for who-knows-why.

I have a question about dwarven traits. I notice that in the PHB it lists their +2 racial bonus on saving throws for posion and spells/spell-like effects separately. In several source materials, they write it as "+2 [bonus] on saving throws against poison, spells, or spell-like effects." The word [bonus] appears in some materials and not others.

Why drop "racial" or "racial bonus" from the description? Is "racial" a legitimate bonus type? I would think so. The d20 Standard Statblock doesn't have it listed, though (as if that means anything).

Why use the "or" conjuction and not "and"? Dwarves are protected against all types. Maybe because it means only one +2 can be in effect at a time (see below).

By the PHB, there are two entries: "+2 racial bonus on saving throws against poison" and "+2 racial bonus on saving throws against spells and spell-like effects." Does this mean that a dwarf attacked by a spell with a poison effect gets a +4 bonus to his save? I would say no by the PHB (racial bonus). But by other materials, it isn't as clear since the bonus is universal (no "racial" qualifier).

Cheers,
/ds

 

[Ricimer]

In the case of a poison spell: +2 to resist the spell. If the suceed, no further effects. If they fail and the poison takes hold they get a +2 to resisting the effects of the poison (like secondary constitution damage for instance).

The reason [bonus] was dropped: probably because it is implied (which isn't a safe thing to assume in anything outlining rules, WoTC should know this!).

As for the racial, I don't know why they dropped it and made it an unnamed bonus. Probably because it isn't an official bonus type, and its meant to stack with anything else anyway, which is what unnamed bonuses do.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

Both the PH and the MM use "racial bonus" so that is what I use. I can only guess that the other entries are shorthand and intend you to use what is listed in the PH and MM.

A bigger problem is the MM entry. It has the dwarven racial bonus to spells and spell-like effects listed as a racial bonus to Will saves against these, not all saves. I was hoping the MM errata would have corrected or clarified this, but it did not. I use the PH version. It does the same thing with elves, too, but most Enchantment spells require Will saves anyway.

 

[DevoutlyApathetic]

In the case of a poison spell: +2 to resist the spell. If the suceed, no further effects. If they fail and the poison takes hold they get a +2 to resisting the effects of the poison (like secondary constitution damage for instance).

So what about the Poison (Clr4/Drd3) spell? It just poisons somebody. You have no save to avoid being poisoned, you get a save to resist the poison.

+2 or +4?

 

[Dr. Zoom]

Your dwarf would get a +2 racial bonus to save vs. the poison. There is no other save against that spell. The +2 racial bonus against poison and against spells do not stack.