Eberron: The Metaphor

[Henry]

Y'know, the more I think about this, the more cheesed off I get. Pulp setting games don't sell more than five copies, but when a D&D setting does "pulp fantasy," that's exciting??? WTF is that about?

The question is, did you notice this factor before Mouseferatu's post? Sometimes it's all in how it's executed. You and I may both know that Star Trek is a western, but a lot of people don't.

What next? D&D martial arts adventures, since Street Fighter was a flop?

Dragonfist

How about D&D does the Old West?

Arcade's Gang

The whole promise of the d20 system was to be able to go beyond D&D -- so why can't the gaming community friggin' DO that?

Different stages of development. Some gamers are ready for something new -- for other gamers, this is the first time they've ever run into a pulpish setting.

 

[The_Gneech]

<snip rant>

I happen to like the new Diet Coke with lime. This does not mean that every time I drink a Diet Coke with lime, I should instead be drinking a limeade.

Nevertheless, if I like limeade but I can only get Diet Coke with lime, you might expect me to rant about it from time to time.

-The Gneech

 

[Mouseferatu]

Anyway, I think Mouseferatu's original comparison is quite apt, but Eberron isn't just aping pre-WWII Europe. And its success or lack thereof will have little connection to the success or failure of pulp adventure stories set in the 20's-40's. It's D&D, not Spellslinger or Dragonstar or Iron Kingdoms, and that difference goes beyond just the name on the cover.

Precisely. Eberron isn't aping or copying anything. My post was meant to discuss the metaphor involved in the game. It's an omni-present metaphor, but it's still metaphor. I happen to love the notion of the pulp adventure feel in a D&D game. But it's important to remember that Eberron is, first and foremost, D&D. It's just D&D with a spin.

If I want to play a pulp game set in the 30s, I've got Adventure. If I want to play D&D with a similar feel, I've got Eberron. They do not, and do not appear meant to, fill the same niche. They simply happen to have a thematic resonance. (See the Indiana Jones/Star Wars/Eberron comment made previously.)

And I want to go on record, in case I wasn't sufficiently clear... I love this setting. I love what they've done, I love the fact that they've designed the world so that it can include all the tropes of pulp adventure without making it any less D&D. And that's the thing. I am, first and foremost, a fantasy fan. I like sci-fi, I like horror, I like pulp, and I'll play games based on any of those. Given my druthers, however, I'll usually go for fantasy--and, if I'm in the right mood, include one of the others in it. (Not always; I'm sometimes in the mood for something else. But often.)

If Eberron hadn't come out, and I wanted to play a fantasy pulp game, I wouldn't say "Oh, well, close enough," and play Adventure. I do that when I'm in the mood for pulp without the fantasy. I'd simply have made up a D&D pulp homebrew and run with it.

I know how frustrating it can be when you can't play what you want, and I sympathize. But I think blaming Eberron for it, or the people who buy it, is a bit misplaced. I can't speak for everyone, but I'm willing to bet that most people who love Eberron for the pulp feel still wouldn't have been focusign their efforts where you want them if it hadn't been released.

 

[resistor]

And of course, you do have the Lord of Blades. But while you might make the LoB/Hitler comparison, the problem is that the Warforged themselves are relatively few in number, and they certainly have a lot of valid grievances;

Actually, that's not really a problem. The Germans also had a lot of valid complaints (mostly involving getting screwed at the Treaty of Versailles ending WWI) that helped pave the way for a violent movement like the Nazis. One of the reasons Hitler became powerful was because he offered a chance to redeem them from the insults that had been shot at them in the past.

 

[Andre La Roche]

Nevertheless, if I like limeade but I can only get Diet Coke with lime, you might expect me to rant about it from time to time.

-The Gneech

You can get your limeade just fine. Just don't throw a tantrum when everyone else drinks Diet Coke with lime.

 

[The_Gneech]

You can get your limeade just fine. Just don't throw a tantrum when everyone else drinks Diet Coke with lime.

I haven't had limeade in 15 years, and I've been looking.

-The Gneech

 

[BryonD]

I haven't had limeade in 15 years, and I've been looking.

-The Gneech

If you want limeaid and everyone else wants lime coke, then you need to start making your own limeaid or learn to live without it.

 

[d4]

How about D&D does the Old West? "Black Bart and his gang o' half-orcs gone and shot up the elvish settlement! Paladins, summon your mounts and let's ride! But under no circumstances let us play a straightforward western game!"

hey, that was MY submission to WOTC's Setting Search Contest!

 

[fanboy2000]

Veteran's Day

One other interesting thing to note, The Treaty of Thronehold was signed on the 11th day on Aryth in 996. Aryth is the 11th month of the Eberron calendar. WWI ended on Nov. 11th, 1918. (The Treaty of Versailles was signed the next year.) 1996 was the last year TSR Inc. was an independant company, WotC bought TSR the next year. Most of what's in the book dosen't have some kind of direct correlation to the real world. But, it's interesting none the less.

 

[Tarril Wolfeye]

Extending the metaphor

I would see these relations:

Aundair - France (wine, etc.)
Breland - Great Britain (parliament, etc.)
Karrnath - Germany (Evil troops, an evil leader, beer,...)
Thrane - Maybe Italy/Vatican (religion, etc.)
Cyre - ???
This would fit with the enmity of Aundair and Karrnath and with some other characteristics and feels of the 5 Nations. I'm at loss concerning other lands in Eberron. (Okay, the Mror Holds are obviously Switzerland )