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Message: <blockquote data-quote="jgsugden" data-source="post: 8006040" data-attributes="member: 2629">This whole thread has been a series of people claiming the subclass is overpowered (without substantiating it) and other people telling them to simmer down, explain what you think is broken and what your experiences are, and then analysis that shows that there is very little going on here that is actually that special.I always go back to the Mystic Theurge when these Hexblade/Echo Knight/Cleric of Order broke the game arguments.  Mystic Theurge was a 3E option offered that blew people's minds.  It gave you access to wizard AND cleric spells.  Your spellcasting fell a few levels behind a pure spellcaster, but while they were casting 7th level wizard spells, you had access to both 6th level wizard AND 6th level cleric spells.People claimed it was ridiculously broken.  They swore it ruined the game.  They said EVERY spellcaster would be a Mystic Theurge from that point on.  The vast majority of people on Enworld, on the WotC boards, on other boards - they all called it insanely overpowered.... and then it actually hit the tables and people started to discover it felt weak.  Very.  It was playable, but you were playing with toys that other people got 10 to 15 sessions earlier.  You were the 4th kid that never had any new clothes - just a series of hand-me-downs from your older brothers and sisters.  Echo Knight looks cool and creates some interesting and fun options.  However, when you get down to it, there are only a few things you can do with it that you can't achieve in other reasonably accessible methods.  It is cool to teleport over the pit (rather than jumping it).  It is cool see an enemy waste a spell on a target that can't be impacted by it (rather than have someone make a saving throw).  But it is not broken.  And it sounds like you have not put any battles in front of the PCs where the image is entirely negated, yet.  Those happen.  Then you feel a lot like a fighter with no subclass at all, which is kind of unfun.</blockquote>

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