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<blockquote data-quote="Spatula" data-source="post: 86855" data-attributes="member: 2198">*sigh*&nbsp; I wonder if the previous threads are still findable without the board's search function.CR is not ECL.&nbsp; CR is a rough measure of what level of challenge a creature can offer a balanced party.&nbsp; It assumes the creature is used as listed.&nbsp; A MM ogre has a CR of 2, but it also has base stats that are all 10's and 11's, and the following equipment: greatclub, longspear, hide armor (worth about 40-50 gp total).&nbsp; CR is only used for foes of the PCs.ECL is a rough measure of how many character levels a monster is worth.&nbsp; It is only used for PCs.&nbsp; A 0-level PC ogre is 8th level, and has the experience points *and equipment* of an 8th level PC.&nbsp; Also, the character's stats are much higher than normal.So there are 2 different mechanics - one for NPCs and one for PCs.&nbsp; CR does not evaluate how useful a creature's abilities can be over the length of a campaign, only how effective the creature is in combat against a balanced party of 4 PCs.&nbsp; A creature that has at-will spell-like abilities, for example, gets to use those powers maybe 2-3 times in a fight against PCs.&nbsp; A PC with at-will spell-like abilities can use those powers constantly in a variety of different situations.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Spatula, post: 86855, member: 2198"] *sigh* I wonder if the previous threads are still findable without the board's search function. CR is not ECL. CR is a rough measure of what level of challenge a creature can offer a balanced party. It assumes the creature is used as listed. A MM ogre has a CR of 2, but it also has base stats that are all 10's and 11's, and the following equipment: greatclub, longspear, hide armor (worth about 40-50 gp total). CR is only used for foes of the PCs. ECL is a rough measure of how many character levels a monster is worth. It is only used for PCs. A 0-level PC ogre is 8th level, and has the experience points *and equipment* of an 8th level PC. Also, the character's stats are much higher than normal. So there are 2 different mechanics - one for NPCs and one for PCs. CR does not evaluate how useful a creature's abilities can be over the length of a campaign, only how effective the creature is in combat against a balanced party of 4 PCs. A creature that has at-will spell-like abilities, for example, gets to use those powers maybe 2-3 times in a fight against PCs. A PC with at-will spell-like abilities can use those powers constantly in a variety of different situations. [/QUOTE]

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