D&D 4E Elements and energies in 4e

[Masquerade]

It added elemental damage types. Earth, air, fire and water. A third level "equivalent" of fireball is sorcerous blast. At the time of casting, you choose one of those four elements. If you cast a 4th level version (called a heightened spell), you can choose to have it do energy (the traditional 5 D&D energies) instead. The system also included protection from element spells. In practice, what it meant was that you were unlikely to have a protection running that an enemy caster couldn't find a way around quickly. It's still nice in that it uses the 'traditional' elements, but it does open the doors to taking more damage from spells.

Huh. Thanks for filling me in!

 

[Loincloth of Armour]

I never really minded earth energy being acid. After all, unlike lightning, fire, and cold, and like something that physically exists like rock, you can hold some acid in your hand (until it eats through your skin).

What I'd like to see (but we won't) would be the elements work something like minor manipulation/ major manipulation:

Air

• Minor Manipulation: Air (gust of wind, etc)
• Major Manipulation: lightning

Water

• Minor Manipulation: Water (Water walk, water breathing, etc)
• Major Manipulation: Ice/Cold (I know ice is just frozen water, work with me here people)

Earth

• Minor Manipulation: Earth (stoneskin, etc)
• Major Manipulation: Acid (I know a lot of people don't like it, but I can live with it)

Fire

• Minor Manipulation: Fire
• Major Manipulation: Plasma/Force (basically non-energy damage type spells)

Light/ Positive Energy

• Minor Manipulation: Holy/ Buffs
• Major Manipulation: Healing

Dark/ Negative Energy

• Minor Manipulation: Curse
• Major Manipulation: Inflict

 

[Gloombunny]

I'm hoping they move away from specific "damage types" as a general mechanic, and distinguish spells by their side effects (e.g., setting stuff on fire). I'd like to see more creatures and PCs having a generalized elemental resistance if they have any, and very few that are resistant to some specific elements and not to others. (That sort of thing should mostly be for creatures like elementals, IMO.)

 

[Jhaelen]

I do think lightning has enough of a mythic connection with elemental Air for both to be linked.

Earth and Acid however is stretching it IMHO.

In the Ars Magica system Acid would be manipulated using the Aquam form (i.e. Water).
Interestingly, Ice is manipulated using the Terram form (i.e. Earth), since ice is solid.
IIRC, lightning is associated with Ignem (i.e. Fire), though...
Sonic effects are probably associated with Imaginem, not one of the classic four elements.
I'd have to check the book but there might be some connection to Auram (i.e. Air) as well.

Anyway, it's an interesting variant on how the energy types might be mapped to appropriate elements.

 

[Kaodi]

I could live with them just dropping them all together, but if they keep them they should revise the list.

Air - Cold (kind of weak, though the vast majority of the atmosphere is cold)
Earth - Electricity (we ground for a reason, and don't forget the counterstroke)
Fire - Fire (the most obvious)
Water - Acid (water *is* an acid! sort of)

 

[Chris_Nightwing]

Tales of Symphonia had a neat set of spells, from what I recall. GameFAQs reveals:

- Aqua Edge
- Fire Ball
- Wind Blade
- Stone Blast
- Lightning
- Icicle

S Techs:
- Aqua Laser
- Flame Lance
- Air Blade
- Grave
- Spark Wave
- Freeze Lancer
- Atlas
- Absolute
- Earth Bite
- Prism Sword

T Techs:
- Spread
- Tidal Wave
- Eruption
- Explosion
- Air Thrust
- Cyclone
- Stalagmite
- Ground Dasher
- Thunder Blade
- Indignation
- Ice Tornado
- Raging Mist
- Gravity Well

So Earth, Wind, Fire, Water, Ice and Lightning, then crazy stuff like force and gravity..

I'd like to see a return of the paraelementals and planes, which should make assigning Acid/Lightning/Cold to elements easier.

 

[Stalker0]

A third level "equivalent" "far more powerful version" of fireball is sorcerous blast.

Fixed it for you

 

[Li Shenron]

Just found!

In the Wizards Presents: Worlds and Monsters book, we'll present in more detail 4th Edition's alternative to the Elemental Planes of Water, Fire, Earth, and Air.

 

[fuindordm]

Personally, I don't think energies need to make sense. It's the constituents of matter that have symbolic value, not the "things that can hurt people". As far as I'm concerned, they can just stay as loosely grouped attack modes--some clearly energetic (fire, lightning), some chemical (acid), some anti-energetic (cold), some wierd (force), etc.

Having said that, I did fiddle around last year with a way of integrating the elements and energies into a single system that kind of made sense, at least from a magical point of view. My idea was that the energies represented interactions between adjacent elements. So it looked like this (imagine it arranged in a circle). The carats represent the "natural evolution" towards higher elements.

Spirit
^ Heat (the invisible "fire" that passes from a flame to us)
Fire
^ Lightning (fire coming from the sky, natch)
Air
^ Cold (water can comes from air when it's cold--consider hail, snow, condensation)
Water
^ Acid (water can dissolve solids, acid promotes this)
Earth
^ Force (acts solid, but it isn't there!)
Spirit

Make of it what you will. In this system, an elemental specialist should have access to two energies, not one. Fire specialists get both fireball and lightning bolt, water specialists get both cold and acid, and so on.